In order to remove the cognitive�dissonance�without changing the bylaws, we'd have to more or less scrap most of our principles and entrust our leaders with more authority. �I am opposed to that.<div><br></div><div>If you'd rather change the way we do things to be more in line with our bylaws, then you should form a different working group to come up with processes for that. �This will not be that working group. �This will be a group to work on changing the bylaws.</div>
<div><br></div><div>For those who are unaware, when Noisebridge was founded, there was a whole lot of discussion on what the bylaws should be. �Things were hashed out multiple times, from my understanding. �Then, when our founders went to talk to a lawyer, they scrapped all that and went with more boilerplate bylaws to make it easier for us to get the 501(c)(3).</div>
<div><br></div><div>We are operating with more or less "boilerplate" bylaws.</div><div><br></div><div>Now that we have that, it's more a matter of having the powers that be approve the new bylaws rather than having them accept us as a public benefit organization. �The worst that can happen is they reject the new bylaws and we have to go back and fix the bits they don't like. �It'll be far less of a challenge than our original public benefit request.</div>
<div><br></div><div>And once again, for reference, our bylaws are at the obviously named page:�<a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Bylaws">https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Bylaws</a></div><div><br></div><div>Christie<br clear="all">
_______<br>"The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom." -- W. Blake.<br><br>The outer bounds is only the beginning. <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/genriel/sets/72157623376093724/">http://www.flickr.com/photos/genriel/sets/72157623376093724/</a><br>
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 9:55 AM, jim <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jim@well.com">jim@well.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<br>
� i'm hoping we can reduce or remove the<br>
cognitive dissonance by improving our<br>
community's shared values, expectations,<br>
and behavior rather than by changing the<br>
bylaws. reviewing the bylaws seems a good<br>
idea in that light. expressing them in<br>
simple English strikes me as a good early<br>
move.<br>
� having just read them, i don't see<br>
anything that calls out for modification,<br>
but that's grist for the mill.<br>
<div><div></div><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On Wed, 2010-02-24 at 08:35 -0800, Christie Dudley wrote:<br>
> I am wanting to look at the entire set of bylaws. �I'd like to go<br>
> through everything and see what we can do to eliminate the "cognitive<br>
> dissonance" that Shannon referred to.<br>
><br>
> For example, were you aware that the bylaws included rules on how to<br>
> remove members? �Remember that debate we had raging for so long and<br>
> how we never resolved it? �As it turns out, we have always had a<br>
> legally binding method of doing so. �The problem with the<br>
><br>
><br>
> I feel that if we do a good job of this, we'll only have to deal with<br>
> it once and we'll be done with it. �I'm going to try to get as many<br>
> questions as I can "hallway answered" by the non-profit tax attorney<br>
> next door. �I hope that can help guide us in constructing something<br>
> that's fairly inexpensive to review, if we have to pay at all.<br>
><br>
><br>
> Yes, I realize people feel that there's a lot better use for our<br>
> money. �I can see the point, but it's my perspective that this is more<br>
> like insurance. �It's pretty worthless... right up to the point where<br>
> there's a problem and then it's absolutely necessary.<br>
><br>
><br>
> Christie<br>
> _______<br>
> "The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom." -- W. Blake.<br>
><br>
> The outer bounds is only the beginning.<br>
> <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/genriel/sets/72157623376093724/" target="_blank">http://www.flickr.com/photos/genriel/sets/72157623376093724/</a><br>
><br>
><br>
> On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 7:17 AM, jim <<a href="mailto:jim@well.com">jim@well.com</a>> wrote:<br>
><br>
><br>
> � � � � � I think reviewing the bylaws makes sense, but I'm<br>
> � � � � leery of making any changes. The only specific<br>
> � � � � objection I heard at last night's meeting was that we<br>
> � � � � haven't produced an annual report. This does not seem<br>
> � � � � optional, given the interests of government audits of<br>
> � � � � our 501(c)3 status. Therefore, instead of changing<br>
> � � � � the bylaws, it seems to me we should change our<br>
> � � � � behavior so's to comply.<br>
> � � � � � My offer to help write the report is sincere;<br>
> � � � � seems to me that it's a lonely job likely to be<br>
> � � � � undone without at least one other person willing to<br>
> � � � � participate, maybe bring pizza or do the typing or<br>
> � � � � make rude jokes while getting it done....<br>
> � � � � � Jonathan's idea of creating an alternate set of<br>
> � � � � bylaws strikes me as useful if it's a simple English<br>
> � � � � interpretation that does not contradict the existing<br>
> � � � � bylaws.<br>
> � � � � � Having a get-together seems like it could be fun,<br>
> � � � � though I don't see a need for anyone to be a header-<br>
> � � � � upper, though a coordinator role seems great.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> � � � � On Wed, 2010-02-24 at 00:26 -0800, Christie Dudley wrote:<br>
> � � � � > So at the meeting today, the discussion topic I had<br>
> � � � � submitted got<br>
> � � � � > shuffled off to a committee. �Since I am really interested<br>
> � � � � in seeing<br>
> � � � � > the bylaws change to better reflect the way we actually<br>
> � � � � operate, I'd<br>
> � � � � > like to head up this committee. �I might pop a few questions<br>
> � � � � by my<br>
> � � � � > lawyerly neighbor who might have a few bits of advice to get<br>
> � � � � us<br>
> � � � � > started.<br>
> � � � � ><br>
> � � � � ><br>
> � � � � > Who else is interested in hacking away at the legalese to<br>
> � � � � bend it to<br>
> � � � � > the collective will of Noisebridge? �I'm really flexible as<br>
> � � � � to<br>
> � � � � > available time, so we can work the meetings around<br>
> � � � � interested people's<br>
> � � � � > schedules. �It should be fun! �(In a rather pedantic sort of<br>
> � � � � way...)<br>
> � � � � ><br>
> � � � � ><br>
> � � � � > Christie<br>
> � � � � > _______<br>
> � � � � > "The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom." -- W.<br>
> � � � � Blake.<br>
> � � � � ><br>
> � � � � > The outer bounds is only the beginning.<br>
> � � � � > <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/genriel/sets/72157623376093724/" target="_blank">http://www.flickr.com/photos/genriel/sets/72157623376093724/</a><br>
><br>
> � � � � > _______________________________________________<br>
> � � � � > Noisebridge-discuss mailing list<br>
> � � � � > <a href="mailto:Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net">Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
> � � � � ><br>
> � � � � <a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss</a><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
<br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>