The guideline is that anything that requires a formal consensus needs to be brought up and discussed a week in advance -- in other words, that we do not formally consense on something the same week it's introduced as an item to be consensed on.<br>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Patrick Keys <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:citizenkeys@gmail.com">citizenkeys@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
This came up at last Friday's consensus meeting...<br>
<br>
* Apparently, the guideline is that the agenda for the weekly meeting<br>
should be posted a full week in advance, if nothing else so that any<br>
stakeholder in a potential consensus item knows to show up.<br>
<br>
* However, in practice, much is brought up spontaneously at the meeting.<br>
Therefore, anything brought up spontaneously should not be decided and<br>
left for a decision the following week.<br>
<br>
* Also, a better set of guidelines for past meeting note would result in<br>
a more consistent archive of meeting notes. Also, if the reasoning for<br>
any consensus decisions were contained in the meeting notes then<br>
everybody would have a reliable place to understand how decisions were made.<br>
<br>
* There is now a meeting notes archive page that I'm still working on,<br>
which will eventually have more columns for consensus items, new members<br>
that were consensed, etc...<br>
<br>
<a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_Archive" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_Archive</a><br>
<br>
<br>
Patrick<br>
<div class="im"><br>
<br>
<br>
On 2/15/2011 8:02 AM, rachel lyra hospodar wrote:<br>
> Thanks for taking the notes! I know we've talked about creating<br>
> guidelines for this, have we ever?<br>
> For example, it would be cool if the new member names consistently made<br>
> it into the notes so people could know who we'll be consensing on in the<br>
> coming weeks.<br>
><br>
</div>> <a href="http://mediumreality.com" target="_blank">mediumreality.com</a> <<a href="http://mediumreality.com" target="_blank">http://mediumreality.com</a>><br>
<div class="im">><br>
> On Feb 14, 2011 12:13 AM, "Seth David Schoen" <<a href="mailto:schoen@loyalty.org">schoen@loyalty.org</a><br>
</div><div><div></div><div class="h5">> <mailto:<a href="mailto:schoen@loyalty.org">schoen@loyalty.org</a>>> wrote:<br>
> > Sorry for the delay. These are now posted at<br>
> ><br>
> > <a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2011_02_08" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2011_02_08</a><br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> > ==Meeting notes for February 8, 2011 general meeting==<br>
> ><br>
> > A Noisebridge meeting! Started at 20:30.<br>
> ><br>
> > What Noisebridge is!<br>
> ><br>
> > Moderator: Al<br>
> ><br>
> > Notetaker: Seth<br>
> ><br>
> > ===Introductions===<br>
> ><br>
> > Hi everybody.<br>
> ><br>
> > ===Consensus process===<br>
> ><br>
> > ===Announcements===<br>
> ><br>
> > On Friday 2011-02-11T18:00 there will be a meeting of people who<br>
> > are interested in learning more about consensus or improving<br>
> > their participation in the consensus process or the process<br>
> > itself.<br>
> ><br>
> > ===Recurring events===<br>
> ><br>
> > Apart from the ones listed on the web page,<br>
> ><br>
> > * Be the Hack is meeting on Tuesdays right before the general meeting.<br>
> > * Note upcoming 5mof on 2010-02-17!<br>
> ><br>
> > ===Consensus items===<br>
> ><br>
> > ====Stickers====<br>
> ><br>
> > Mitch making stickers -- Noisebridge to pay.<br>
> ><br>
> > Mitch describes the various sizes of vinyl stickers that he can have<br>
> made with Jakprints $825 (the one we've been using before) or Sticker<br>
> Giant $775 (one that Josh recommended). This does not include shipping.<br>
> ><br>
> > We will get them in two sizes and in both black and white and black<br>
> and red. Black and white was originally a mistake, but people continue<br>
> to like them.<br>
> ><br>
> > Q. What is the state of our treasury? Can we afford it?<br>
> ><br>
> > A. We will ask the treasurer.<br>
> ><br>
> > Treasurer. Yes, we can. We will still be above our three months'<br>
> > expenses in the bank. Our finances are currently stable again.<br>
> ><br>
> > Mitch will purchase the stickers from Sticker Giant this time.<br>
> ><br>
> > Consensus item is approved.<br>
> ><br>
> > ===Treasurer's Report===<br>
> ><br>
> > Bank balance is $17,750.78. We have paid rent for February but not<br>
> for March.<br>
> ><br>
> > Donations are higher than they were in the fall, though not as high<br>
> as right when Shannon first publicized that we were having financial<br>
> trouble. However, income still remains higher than expenses.<br>
> ><br>
> > ===Discussion items===<br>
> ><br>
> > ====Cleaning====<br>
> ><br>
> > Proposal: Noisebridge should buy a vacuum cleaner. We have a shopvac<br>
> but it's too loud.<br>
> ><br>
> > Seth: Can I play<br>
> [<a href="http://www.jonathancoulton.com/wiki/index.php/Shop_Vac" target="_blank">http://www.jonathancoulton.com/wiki/index.php/Shop_Vac</a> the song]?<br>
> ><br>
> > Other people: No.<br>
> ><br>
> > Proposal: We should get a professional-type backpack-style $300 HEPA<br>
> vacuum.<br>
> ><br>
> > - We should keep financial discipline by not spending our funds on<br>
> everything.<br>
> ><br>
> > - Can't we buy a $30 vacuum on Craigslist?<br>
> ><br>
> > - Wouldn't it be easier to ask for a donated vacuum cleaner?<br>
> ><br>
> > - We can hack the vacuum cleaner into a backpack.<br>
> ><br>
> > - But it wouldn't have a HEPA filter.<br>
> ><br>
> > - We can find working vacuum cleaners on the street.<br>
> ><br>
> > Suggestion: Mitch will try to find one on the street and Rachel will<br>
> hack it.<br>
> ><br>
> > - According to Danny's survey, people complain about the space being<br>
> dirty much more than they complain about mailing list drama or anything<br>
> else.<br>
> ><br>
> > - But we have brooms already!<br>
> ><br>
> > - A vacuum cleaner might lower the barrier to cleaning compared to a<br>
> broom, because it's more fun.<br>
> ><br>
> > Q. What about putting a broom in a backpack?<br>
> ><br>
> > - Buying the vacuum cleaner would cost money but it would make<br>
> cleaning more appealing.<br>
> ><br>
> > Q. Let's ask the treasurer whether we can afford this expense!<br>
> ><br>
> > Treasurer: Yes, we could afford this now. But given that expense, why<br>
> don't we hire instead hire a cleaning service that already has one of these?<br>
> ><br>
> > Discussion about the idea of hiring a cleaning service. This might be<br>
> expensive because of the size of the space.<br>
> ><br>
> > - Buying a vacuum is a one-time expense, unlike hiring a cleaning<br>
> service which is a recurring expense.<br>
> ><br>
> > Treasurer: Buying a vacuum is obviously cheaper than hiring someone<br>
> but maybe we shouldn't buy a vacuum if we hire someone.<br>
> ><br>
> > - We were discussing hiring someone to clean the bathroom only, but<br>
> we haven't agreed on this yet.<br>
> ><br>
> > - Perhaps we should buy a cheap vacuum and see whether people use it.<br>
> ><br>
> > - We should get quotes about what cleaning services would charge.<br>
> ><br>
> > Q. How much would people be comfortable spending on a cleaning service?<br>
> ><br>
> > - We could get a machine that wet-cleans the floor rather than just a<br>
> vacuum.<br>
> ><br>
> > - If it were clean, maybe more people would join and more people<br>
> would use the space. This might actually make up for the extra expense.<br>
> ><br>
> > - Danny's poll didn't actually ask whether people would use the space<br>
> more or differently based on cleanliness. We just know that it's the<br>
> most common complaint.<br>
> ><br>
> > - There may be a baseline amount of effort going into cleaning the<br>
> space which could go into other kinds of improvements to the space, like<br>
> organization. This would be great.<br>
> ><br>
> > Q. Roomba?<br>
> ><br>
> > - People would turn them into killer robots. (NB: the<br>
> [<a href="https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/IRobot#Military_and_policing_robots" target="_blank">https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/IRobot#Military_and_policing_robots</a><br>
> company that makes Roombas actually makes military robots too]!)<br>
> ><br>
> > - Also, we probably have too much stuff for a Roomba.<br>
> ><br>
> > - We just discovered that we actually DO have a vacuum already!<br>
> ><br>
> > - The problem may be the clutter, not the cleanliness. If only we had<br>
> a larger space, it would be less cluttered because we would have more<br>
> places for things.<br>
> ><br>
> > - It's not clear how the cleaning would affect the organization.<br>
> There are rival theories.<br>
> ><br>
> > Q. Does anyone want to get quotes?<br>
> ><br>
> > - Andy did already or said he would be willing to. Claudia has a<br>
> contact with a housekeeper and Andy has a contact with a commercial<br>
> office cleaning service.<br>
> ><br>
> > - We should label more things in terms of their purpose and destiny.<br>
> ><br>
> > - We could get a truck and take some stuff away.<br>
> ><br>
> > Q. What about the nerf guns? How can we decide on whether to get rid<br>
> of things?<br>
> ><br>
> > - The consensus process may not be the right way to decide on<br>
> individual items.<br>
> ><br>
> > - Shannon is forming a "hitting crap with a hammer" committee<br>
> (consisting only of himself). If your stuff looks like junk, you should<br>
> make it look less like junk so he won't hit it with a hammer.<br>
> ><br>
> > - Excellence vs. do-ocracy. It would be better to photograph things<br>
> and write to the list about them before throwing them away.<br>
> ><br>
> > - Throwing away the stuff in the trash room!<br>
> ><br>
> > - Webcam in the trash room!?<br>
> ><br>
> > - The trash room could be a staging area for things that will<br>
> (actually) be thrown away!<br>
> ><br>
> > Treasurer: Taking things to the dump incurs monetary expenses, as<br>
> doing renting trucks. Hopefully people will donate those expenses when<br>
> they rent them. However, if things get carted to the dump Noisebridge<br>
> will reimburse them for the dump fee.<br>
> ><br>
> > Shannon will reimburse them for the truck rental fee for this purpose.<br>
> ><br>
> > ====Turing====<br>
> ><br>
> > Shannon wants to talk about Turing (the room) after the meeting.<br>
> ><br>
> > ===Membership binder===<br>
> ><br>
> > Names were read.<br>
> ><br>
> > Meeting ended at 21:30.<br>
> ><br>
> > --<br>
</div></div>> > Seth David Schoen <<a href="mailto:schoen@loyalty.org">schoen@loyalty.org</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:schoen@loyalty.org">schoen@loyalty.org</a>>> |<br>
<div class="im">> Qué empresa fácil no pensar en<br>
> > <a href="http://www.loyalty.org/~schoen/" target="_blank">http://www.loyalty.org/~schoen/</a> | un tigre, reflexioné.<br>
> > <a href="http://vitanuova.loyalty.org/" target="_blank">http://vitanuova.loyalty.org/</a> | -- Borges, El Zahir<br>
> > _______________________________________________<br>
> > Noisebridge-discuss mailing list<br>
> > <a href="mailto:Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net">Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Shannon Lee<br>(503) 539-3700<br><br>"Any sufficiently analyzed magic is indistinguishable from science."<br>