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On <i style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: 'Times New Roman';
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-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">Fri
May 10 17:57:36 UTC 2013</i>, Michael Clift, occupirate at
gmail.com, wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">I think NB should be able to "accommodate" out of
towners here on business</blockquote>
-i think we should accommodate out-of-towners here for
hacking-related activities. not business. <br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite"> ...this war on sleeping is stupid.<br>
</blockquote>
-i.m.o., a war on napping is petty, and would be unnecessary if some
people were not periodically living here. <br>
-Napping has a rich history among inventors and artists. <br>
-i.m.o., we should continue to ensure that we are not breaking the
lease or violating city ordinances<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">we should be as hospitable as possible. </blockquote>
-true dat<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">Get back to work </blockquote>
-hmm, not so crazy about you barking orders at people.<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">stop griping about homeless hackers<br>
</blockquote>
-some of NB's most valuable and productive people are, were, or will
be homeless. I will do anything in my meager ability to support,
protect, and help homeless hackers. <br>
-i believe it's the <i>non-hackers </i>(homeless or non-homeless)
who some view as a disruption, distraction, and/or theft-risk. <br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">realize that NB is a developing entity unto itself.</blockquote>
-Is it valuable for a hackerspace to have a stated mission? or is it
better to allow NB to be what it will be, organically, without any
rudder or destination or purpose? <br>
-If NB organically became, say:<br>
<ul>
<li>a videogame parlor, and/or <br>
</li>
<li>100% homeless crashers, thieves, meth-heads, people shooting
up in the bathroom and doing whipits at the electronics bench,
and/or <br>
</li>
<li>a recurring mess on the scale of a national-disaster in every
room, chronically broken or stolen equipment, a kitchen infested
with hundreds of fruit-flies and cockroaches, and an entire
space infested with mice (no resemblance to any actual
hackerspace intended)<br>
</li>
</ul>
-Is that outcome consistent with the founders' vision? Is it an
outcome we as a community would be happy about? Is it an outcome
with which you, Michael, are content? Is it an outcome that we are <i>obligated
</i>to accept, because it happened organically?<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">"if it aint hurtin nothing, leave it be".<br>
</blockquote>
-Fo sho'. But if it IS hurtin....<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite"> Now, NB junkie hackers need to be more vigilant about
leaving their works laying around</blockquote>
-Friend, you're saying that junkies mainlining in the bathroom is
just fine, as long as folks pack up their needles. I love San
Francisco. <br>
-Personally, I can deal, but many cannot. To those driven away by
such activities, do we say "fuck 'em"?<br>
-Any founding docs which could lend insight? <br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">I am of the opinion that the whole "membership" thing
is ... aptly demonstrated by people who happen to have "homes" </blockquote>
-i wonder, have there never have been any homeless people who became
members, or members who became homeless?<br>
-I'm not homeless, but i have been. Please don't hate me for having
a roof over my head at the moment. It's not like somebody gave it to
me on a silver platter. Other people got problems too, bro. <br>
-I believe in work. i believe in earning one's keep in this world.
I'm just against exploitation. No one should sacrifice their best
energies to some heartless corporation. i know this whole country is
screwing everyone except the rich. Those on the bottom get hit
hardest. It IS capitalist brutality. <br>
-But America's socioeconomic injustice is not Noisebridge's fault or
burden. Non-hacking people should not exploit Noisebridge. <br>
-i can only afford $10/month, so i'm not a member. But lack of
membership has not impeded my use of NB one bit. I don't feel looked
down on, as a non-member. But maybe that's because i hack. It's a
hackerspace. <br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">...the techno-weenie/isolated/weirdo lifestyles of
these struggling bobos. </blockquote>
-ha-ha. colorful description. <br>
-But, techno-weenies are core hacker culture. It's a hackerspace.<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">NB HAS been described IN PRINT and the MEDIA as an
anarchist based collective that is all inclusive. </blockquote>
-But, how does Noisebridge describe itself in print?<br>
-Has the NB community ever formally described "what Noisebridge is
and isn't"? I would find that helpful. <br>
-I don't mean a wiki page that some member/non-member posted,
describing their personal opinion. I mean a shared, collectively
ratified document. <br>
-Is creating a shared, collectively ratified Mission Statement an
act of Fascism? Or is it something NB should urgently achieve, to
bring clarity to future debates and decisions?<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CANJg-05S5y99zeVT_U2q=DBnyVOK==1+efpQ9EmGbOCyxz=Edw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">we are all SHARING the space, and should not waste
time attempting to dominate the space by asserting status</blockquote>
-i must say, friend, that when you bitch about
"techno-weenie/isolated/weirdo lifestyles of these struggling
bobos", you do not sound "all-inclusive"; you're asserting status as
the opposite of that. <br>
<br>
Regards,<font size="+1"><br>
<br>
Johny Radio<br>
Stick It In Your Ear!<br>
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