<div dir="ltr"><br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 9:04 PM, Yan Zhu <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:yan@mit.edu" target="_blank">yan@mit.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr"><div><div><div>Hi Carl (and Noisebridge), <br><br></div>Thanks for the information. I had the impression that Liz was acting as Lillian's advocate, but if this is not the case and one is needed, I'll volunteer with Lillian's permission [1] [2]. However, I will be leaving the country in two weeks, so I won't be able to interact with you all in-person past then. <br>
<br></div><div>Carl: Is there any other mediation help that you need? <br></div><div><br></div>[1] I'm not sure if she's on the list still. <br></div><div><br></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>[2] There is no second footnote. <br>
</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div></div>-Yan <br><br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br><div class="gmail_quote"><div><div class="h5">On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 8:16 PM, Liz Henry <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:lizhenry@gmail.com" target="_blank">lizhenry@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br></div></div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div class="h5">
<div dir="ltr"><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Sounds reasonable Carl. I think it is not so much "to decide Dru's fate" but, to decide whether we want to hang out with him and basically welcome him. <br>
<br></div><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">I think the idea of Dru remaining away from the space until he can come to a meeting where this is discussed is a good one.<br><br></div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> <br></div><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Cheers<br><br>Liz<br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 7:25 PM, Carl <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:carl@icarp.info" target="_blank">carl@icarp.info</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Hi all,<br>
Lillian, and others involved...<br>
<br>
I apologize for not getting on this mediation sooner. I've been ill this past week. It would be helpful if others would also like to step up to help. (so far Liz and Kevin have stepped up)<br>
<br>
Perhaps "mediation" isn't the correct term to use, how about "task force", "committee", or "investigation". Anyhow, we use the term "mediation" because that is the process that Noisebridge has set up for issues like these. We even have a wiki page set up for it:<br>
<a href="https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Mediation" target="_blank">https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Mediation</a><br>
<br>
On that page it suggests that in order for a problem to brought up at a group meeting, someone must step forward to act as an "advocate" for the individual. All parties involved should have advocates when an issue is brought up at a weekly meeting.<br>
<br>
The reason that nothing has been done so far, prior to Lillian's posting on the mailing list last week, is that:<br>
<br>
1. No one has been actively advocating on Lillian's behalf, although Liz did bring up the issue at a meeting. I hope that someone will stand up to advocate on her behalf (if not Liz).<br>
<br>
2. There wasn't sufficient information presented for the membership to make any decision on banning. Basically, all we knew was that some person, who wished to remain anonymous, was accusing Dru of sexual harassment, while no description of what occurred was presented, and no other witness accounts came forth. It shouldn't be any surprise that this was insufficient for a motion to ban someone.<br>
<br>
Since Lillian came forth with her account of events, we have more detailed info to act upon.<br>
<br>
The recent revelation of emails between Dru and Dante may also help shed light on the case.<br>
<br>
Dru denies any wrongdoing.<br>
<br>
We can't just automatically ban Dru without some sort of due process, at least not permanently, as Lillian suggest. What we can do is temporarily ban Dru while this investigation takes place. This may be a course of action we can take to be brought up at the next meeting.<br>
<br>
<br>
The next steps then are as follows:<br>
<br>
- Fact finding. Obtain any other relevant evidence and witness accounts. I would highly encourage others to come forth to tell us what you know. If you wish to remain anonymous, you may contact either myself or Liz, for the time being, and we will respect your wishes.<br>
<br>
- Since Noisebridge is taking upon itself to act as a "court" to decide Dru's fate, we should establish some procedures to handle this. Each party must have an advocate. Evidence is to be presented. A jury weighs the evidence and makes a judgement. Typically the jury is simply the membership present at a Tuesday night meeting.<br>
<br>
- If it is decided that Dru did wrong based on the evidence presented, or that it be decided that he is likely to cause harm in the future, then the jury would also consense on a course of action that Dru must follow. This may be a permanent ban. It may be something else, such as require him to take a course on "sexual harassment sensitivity", which some workplaces require -- I don't know.<br>
<br>
- This is assuming he is found guilty. Some may not be convinced that he is. That is why we need to collect evidence and go through this process.<br>
<br>
- Dru says that he is wrongly accused. He at least deserves to present a defense, since it's his reputation on the line.<br>
<br>
<br>
Some evidence that I would like to find out more about:<br>
<br>
- Lillian says "others who still use the space have expressed to me that they don't feel safe around Andrew either." - We would like to hear this testimony.<br>
- I still haven't talked with Dante about his experience and the emails.<br>
- Any other witnesses. We need you to come forward.<br>
<br>
<br>
I think Noisebridge is very much concerned about safety in our space, and we certainly would like to avoid scaring people off from coming here, as well as our reputation. Issues like these are never pleasant to deal with, but we do because as in any community these issues do come up. It's good that we're out in the open about it, even though it risks alienating people from visiting our space, I think it's overall better this way. It's like open-source software vs. closed-source: We risk showing the world all our bugs, but at least they're more likely to be fixed, vs. hiding our bugs and not fixing them. I think the alternative would be a space that isn't as safe.<br>
<br>
<br>
cheers<br>
<span><font color="#888888">-Carl<br>
<br><span><font color="#888888">
</font></span></font></span></blockquote></div><span><font color="#888888"><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><div dir="ltr"><div><br>. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .<br>Liz Henry<br></div><a href="mailto:lhenry@mozilla.com" target="_blank">lhenry@mozilla.com</a><br>
<a href="mailto:lizhenry@gmail.com" target="_blank">lizhenry@gmail.com</a><br></div>
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<br></blockquote></div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Yan Zhu<br><a href="http://web.mit.edu/zyan/www/" target="_blank">http://web.mit.edu/zyan/www/</a>
</font></span></div>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Yan Zhu<br><a href="http://web.mit.edu/zyan/www/" target="_blank">http://web.mit.edu/zyan/www/</a>
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