<div dir="ltr">That sound extremely reasonable but certain (now) Council Members blocked proposals for just that and then when we finally got that, it was changed weeks later. </div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">
On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 9:10 AM, Jessica Ross <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jessica.r.ross@gmail.com" target="_blank">jessica.r.ross@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">Is there a reason why there's 24 hour access? It seems like you guys can't staff it appropriately for that.</div><div class="gmail_extra"><div><div class="h5"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 11:06 AM, Ronald Cotoni <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:setient@gmail.com" target="_blank">setient@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">TBQH part of a hacker space is trying new things. All of the hackerspaces on the planet have different sets of issues and deal with them differently. An approach in one place may not work very well elsewhere. So I submit to you this is a different form of hacking. Policy hacking. Trying different methods until we find the one that fits for us. I am not sure what is happening with Consensus but it would be nice if we had a board that got us things. By things, I mean making sure the bathrooms were clean either by doocracy or by paying someone to do it. Making sure the sprinkler system works. Making sure we have fire extinguishers. Making sure people are respecting the space. Usually this could be done by doocracy but with people like you leaving Mark, that is a pipe dream. And for noisebridge, which is 24/7 (sudroom which is not) there are different issues that you don't have to deal with. You may or may not find yourself in the exact same situation with a bigger space. I would strongly suggest reading over the past few years of meeting notes and seeing if you see any similarities between sudoroom and noisebridge since sudoroom is mildly based on noisebridge. </div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div><div>On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 8:53 AM, Torrie Fischer <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:tdfischer@hackerbots.net" target="_blank">tdfischer@hackerbots.net</a>></span> wrote:<br>
</div></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div><div><div>On Thursday, March 13, 2014 07:19:04 Marc Juul wrote:<br>
> On Wed, Mar 5, 2014 at 3:07 PM, Jake <<a href="mailto:jake@spaz.org" target="_blank">jake@spaz.org</a>> wrote:<br>
> > well, you're doing more to fix the infrastructure than I have lately, but<br>
> > that is not the kind of problems i'm talking about.<br>
> ><br>
> > my complaint is that the culture of noisebridge has become so<br>
> > uninteresting<br>
> > and unrelated to hacking that it is bordering on irrelavent. The fact that<br>
> > you are volunteering your time to maintain the internet at a homeless<br>
> > shelter is quaint, but it doesn't change the fact that most hackers don't<br>
> > want to go there anymore.<br>
> ><br>
> > there are two categories of reasons why a hacker would want to go to<br>
> > noisebridge:<br>
> ><br>
> > 1> other hackers are there, and people they can relate to and share<br>
> > interesting conversation with, or just be around while working on projects<br>
> > of their own. People are there experimenting on things, hardware software<br>
> > and other, and one might learn something or teach something or make new<br>
> > friends with similar interests.<br>
> ><br>
> > 2> there is a "safe space" with technical infrastructure. This means that<br>
> > people who refuse to be HIGHLY accountable for problematic behavior are<br>
> > simply not permitted to be present (a much higher standard than we have<br>
> > now). Oh and lets not forget at least one usable bathroom with a decent<br>
> > toilet seat and toilet paper.<br>
> ><br>
> > This also means that the technical infrastructure is in place and usable.<br>
> > For software people this means the internet works and there are outlets,<br>
> > clean places to sit (with decent posture, not fall-in couches) and tables<br>
> > for laptops and room to work with others.<br>
> ><br>
> > For hardware this means that tools are more than just the bottom of the<br>
> > barrel (try finding a pair of scissors or a phillips screwdriver) and that<br>
> > there are actually nice things (a soldering iron with a temperature<br>
> > control<br>
> > instead of $2 china disposable irons), AND more advanced tools are<br>
> > available such as microcontroller programmers, blank microcontrollers,<br>
> > and other electronic hardware for raw material.<br>
> ><br>
> > Noisebridge used to have a great collection of microcontrollers and<br>
> > programmers and breadboards and jumper wires and advanced electronic<br>
> > tools,<br>
> > but all of that stuff was REPEATEDLY taken down from the top shelf and<br>
> > scattered into the e-waste piles, and then thrown away. Yes, our<br>
> > microcontroller and programmer collection has made its way to the trash.<br>
> ><br>
> > categories 1 and 2 are related; if a hackerspace has one without the<br>
> > other, hackers still may not decide to go. Certainly I think both are<br>
> > equally important. I also feel that at this time, and for too long,<br>
> > noisebridge has not had either.<br>
> ><br>
> > P.S. please notice that ONE OF THE THINGS YOU CAN DO TO HELP IS TO GO TO<br>
> > NOISEBRIDGE MORE OFTEN.<br>
><br>
> Since reading the policy that visitors to noisebridge are required to<br>
> have a member vouch for them at all times, I no longer feel welcome at<br>
> noisebridge. I know that several others feel the same way.<br>
><br>
> I remember Jake's original suggestion related to this. The idea was<br>
> that anyone asking a visitor to leave would first have to ask if any<br>
> member is willing to vouch for the visitor to stay, and only if no-one<br>
> vouches can the non-member be asked to leave. That is reasonable.<br>
> Putting the responsibility on the visitor of having a member pre-vouch<br>
> for them at all times is both unwelcoming and unreasonable.<br>
><br>
> Now, I'm seeing one of the board members implying that the board will<br>
> no longer be passive, which I take it to mean that noisebridge is no<br>
> longer ruled by consensus.<br>
<br>
</div></div>I'm just an associate member of noisebridge on the other side of the US with<br>
no real influence, or even a desire to get involved, so here is my $0.02 based<br>
on my previous position of being an officer of SYNHAK, and our terrifyingly<br>
heavy-handed and pre-emptive board that was elected a few weeks ago.<br>
<br>
I feel that it is possible and somewhat important for the management of a<br>
hackerspace to be active while still respecting the wishes of the membership.<br>
The board and officers should still be held responsible to the membership by<br>
the community. Noisebridge bylaws permit the removal of the board, should it<br>
come to that:<br>
<br>
<a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/bylaws#c._Removal_of_Directors" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/bylaws#c._Removal_of_Directors</a><br>
<br>
It is never a good idea for the board to get to such a point that demands for<br>
resignation or removal start showing up (see synhak's discuss@ for many<br>
tears), so I imagine that the consensus process would still be respected.<br>
<br>
SYNHAK is experimenting with a few procedural changes with our governance<br>
structure in the next few weeks in an attempt to curb the decision making<br>
abilities of the board and officers. First, an amendment to our bylaws that<br>
essentially states that the membership runs the space:<br>
<br>
"The powers not delegated to the Officers of SYNHAK by these Bylaws, nor<br>
prohibited to the members through The Board or these Bylaws are reserved to<br>
the Membership."<br>
<br>
Sounds a bit 10th amendment-ish, yeah. It has no real effect on the<br>
corporation other than to explicitly state that the membership is in charge.<br>
The Board still legally retains absolute power and can do things like set a<br>
corporate alcohol and drug policy, approve a new lease, strip membership from<br>
individuals, pass a bylaw amendment that nulls this, etc. It does, however,<br>
give the membership some control over what the management does.<br>
<br>
The second component of this is an upcoming modification to our consensus<br>
process which is roughly based off of Noisebridge's. It adds three constraints<br>
on blocking consensus: One person may block consensus for no longer than 6<br>
weeks, an indefinite block can only happen with the support of a total of<br>
three members, and the reason for a block must be clearly and explicitly<br>
written in the meeting minutes.<br>
<br>
Nobody is required to approve of the reason for a block, but this prevents a<br>
single person from stopping the entire process without having to put the<br>
effort in to convince others why their position is valid. While a proposal is<br>
under a block, the community is encouraged to figure out the best way to reach<br>
consensus on the issue.<br>
<br>
If you're worried about consensus being steamrolled by the board, perhaps<br>
those concerns are best addressed by asking the board to explain how they feel<br>
Noisebridge's governance process fits in with their plans. Reaching consensus<br>
about respecting consensus, if you will.<br>
<div><div><br>
><br>
> It makes me both sad and angry that noisebridge has become a place<br>
> where hackers don't feel welcome.<br>
><br>
> If anyone wants to help build a hackerspace similar to what<br>
> noisebridge used to be, I invite you all too come join sudo room in<br>
> oakland as we prepare to move to a much bigger space (a space very<br>
> similar to noisebridge's current space!). We have open meetings every<br>
> Wednesday at 7 pm at 22nd and Broadway, located just two blocks from<br>
> 19th street BART.</div></div><br></div></div><div>_______________________________________________<br>
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<br></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><div><br></div>-- <br>Ronald Cotoni<div>Systems Engineer</div>
</div></div>
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<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br></div></div><div dir="ltr">Jessica R. Ross<br><a href="mailto:jessica.r.ross@gmail.com" target="_blank">jessica.r.ross@gmail.com</a></div>
</div>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br>Ronald Cotoni<div>Systems Engineer</div>
</div>