<p dir="ltr">Thanks for trolling the list with that nsfw image. Moderators can we moderate that user?</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Apr 3, 2014 5:00 PM, "Naomi Most" <<a href="mailto:pnaomi@gmail.com">pnaomi@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Pretty sure the dishwasher either broke or was never properly set up<br>
to begin with. It was only in the space for maybe 3 months after we<br>
opened at 2169.<br>
<br>
--Naomi<br>
<br>
<br>
On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 4:35 PM, Ceren Ercen <<a href="mailto:ceren@ercen.com">ceren@ercen.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> A dishwasher will not change the behavior of people who leave kitchen<br>
> garbage and dirty plates out. Anyone who has ever had a roommate, ever,<br>
> knows that. And hell, usually, I'm "that" roommate!<br>
><br>
> On Apr 3, 2014 7:33 PM, "daravinne" <<a href="mailto:daravinne@gmail.com">daravinne@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> so uh<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> <a href="http://www.amazon.com/InterDesign-Clean-Dirty-Dishwasher-Indicator/dp/B00004XSF9/" target="_blank">http://www.amazon.com/InterDesign-Clean-Dirty-Dishwasher-Indicator/dp/B00004XSF9/</a><br>
>><br>
>> in the same vein, a reminder sign reminding people to scrape their dishes<br>
>> before putting them in the dishwasher.<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 4:21 PM, Jeffrey Carl Faden <<a href="mailto:jeffreyatw@gmail.com">jeffreyatw@gmail.com</a>><br>
>> wrote:<br>
>>><br>
>>> Agreed. And there's the even simpler problem of not having a single,<br>
>>> easy-to-follow system to determine whether the contents are clean or not.<br>
>>> Still interested in hearing how the first one went away. This is obviously<br>
>>> out of date:<br>
>>> <a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Dishwasher" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Dishwasher</a><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 4:13 PM, Norman Bradley <<a href="mailto:pryankster@gmail.com">pryankster@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>> wrote:<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> The problem I see with a dishwasher is that if people "don't know how to<br>
>>>> wash a disk" then they will most likely won't scrape off the dishes before<br>
>>>> putting in the washer. Repeatedly fixing a plugged up washer can get quite<br>
>>>> expensive.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> You are entitled to your own opinion.<br>
>>>> You are NOT entitled to your own facts.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Norman<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> On 4/3/2014 3:28 PM, daravinne wrote:<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> i said it on the other thread and i will say it again.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> DISHWASHER<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> every company i've worked at has a dishwasher. i hate washing dishes,<br>
>>>> myself. i don't want to waste time away from projects to do boring manual<br>
>>>> labor like washing dishes. and look! we have the technology to make dishes<br>
>>>> be washed themselves!<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> I am willing to throw money at obtaining a dishwasher for the space.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 1:01 PM, Naomi Gmail <<a href="mailto:pnaomi@gmail.com">pnaomi@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> Btw, point of information:<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> sudo room has a dishwasher.<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> --Naomi<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> > On Apr 3, 2014, at 12:29 PM, Naomi Most <<a href="mailto:pnaomi@gmail.com">pnaomi@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>>>>> ><br>
>>>>> > I have no problem believing that some people don't know how to get<br>
>>>>> > dishes clean. I have seen that happen many times in my various<br>
>>>>> > shared<br>
>>>>> > living situations.<br>
>>>>> ><br>
>>>>> > Asserting that people "should not" do a thing if they are ignorant of<br>
>>>>> > something is basically a nonstarter. I don't know how to read what's<br>
>>>>> > available in people's brains as they take a glass from the shelf and<br>
>>>>> > pour a drink. Do you?<br>
>>>>> ><br>
>>>>> > --Naomi<br>
>>>>> ><br>
>>>>> ><br>
>>>>> >> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 12:02 PM, Hannah Grimm <<a href="mailto:dharlette@gmail.com">dharlette@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>>>> >> wrote:<br>
>>>>> >> "2) There is no clear understanding of how to properly use the<br>
>>>>> >> kitchen. The<br>
>>>>> >> average person in the kitchen does not understand how to wash a dish<br>
>>>>> >> and has<br>
>>>>> >> an opportunity to be taught. Once again a couple people are<br>
>>>>> >> mobilized to<br>
>>>>> >> micromanage the kitchen, but there is no greater community<br>
>>>>> >> understanding."<br>
>>>>> >><br>
>>>>> >> Excuse me, what? Dishwashing is a very simple thing. We should not<br>
>>>>> >> have to<br>
>>>>> >> teach people how to wash the dishes. If you do not know how to wash<br>
>>>>> >> your<br>
>>>>> >> own dishes, then you should not be using a community kitchen.<br>
>>>>> >><br>
>>>>> >><br>
>>>>> >>> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 9:52 AM, Praveen Sinha <<a href="mailto:dmhomee@gmail.com">dmhomee@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>>>> >>> wrote:<br>
>>>>> >>><br>
>>>>> >>> THIS IS WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT HELL YEAH COMMUNITY BUILDING<br>
>>>>> >>><br>
>>>>> >>> Thanks so much James and Dana, these conversations and<br>
>>>>> >>> understanding and<br>
>>>>> >>> getting past preconceptions of each other and reporting back is<br>
>>>>> >>> really<br>
>>>>> >>> really important foundational work. Big plus!!!<br>
>>>>> >>><br>
>>>>> >>><br>
>>>>> >>> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 8:05 AM, James Sundquist<br>
>>>>> >>> <<a href="mailto:sundquistjames@gmail.com">sundquistjames@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>>>> >>> wrote:<br>
>>>>> >>>><br>
>>>>> >>>> Last night there was a lengthy discussion about communal usage of<br>
>>>>> >>>> the<br>
>>>>> >>>> kitchen that spontaneously lasted from 9 - 11:30. Coffee and cake<br>
>>>>> >>>> were<br>
>>>>> >>>> served. We talked about do-ocracy, responsibility, and how to<br>
>>>>> >>>> have<br>
>>>>> >>>> effective communication about the kitchen.<br>
>>>>> >>>><br>
>>>>> >>>> A big take away was that people need to talk about this in-person<br>
>>>>> >>>> and<br>
>>>>> >>>> consider how it impacts everyone, because removing the kitchen<br>
>>>>> >>>> will not<br>
>>>>> >>>> remove Noisebridge's problems by itself. I just want to note that<br>
>>>>> >>>> this<br>
>>>>> >>>> really was a discussion, which included everyone being able to<br>
>>>>> >>>> speak their<br>
>>>>> >>>> mind while being respected; the point of talking was to gain<br>
>>>>> >>>> perspective by<br>
>>>>> >>>> asking questions rather than talking over others.<br>
>>>>> >>>><br>
>>>>> >>>> 1) A big reason the daily users of the kitchen do not respect you<br>
>>>>> >>>> is<br>
>>>>> >>>> because they do not know you or feel any connection in the space<br>
>>>>> >>>> without a<br>
>>>>> >>>> communal kitchen. Any valid concerns of those who want to disable<br>
>>>>> >>>> are<br>
>>>>> >>>> unknown to the daily users of the kitchen.<br>
>>>>> >>>><br>
>>>>> >>>> 2) There is no clear understanding of how to properly use the<br>
>>>>> >>>> kitchen.<br>
>>>>> >>>> The average person in the kitchen does not understand how to wash<br>
>>>>> >>>> a dish and<br>
>>>>> >>>> has an opportunity to be taught. Once again a couple people are<br>
>>>>> >>>> mobilized to<br>
>>>>> >>>> micromanage the kitchen, but there is no greater community<br>
>>>>> >>>> understanding.<br>
>>>>> >>>><br>
>>>>> >>>> 3) It is difficult to know how capable we all are of having a<br>
>>>>> >>>> respectful<br>
>>>>> >>>> conversation to allows people to maintain their dignity, because<br>
>>>>> >>>> community<br>
>>>>> >>>> building should be the goal when people are in conflict.<br>
>>>>> >>>><br>
>>>>> >>>> 4) A big part of this as I understood it was reassessing how<br>
>>>>> >>>> people are<br>
>>>>> >>>> introduced to this space. Example, "Welcome to Noisebridge; we're<br>
>>>>> >>>> a 501c3<br>
>>>>> >>>> Non-profit that encourages education and learning by doing. This<br>
>>>>> >>>> is a<br>
>>>>> >>>> Do-It-Yourself space so at a base minimum you're expected to wash<br>
>>>>> >>>> your own<br>
>>>>> >>>> dishes and keep your work area clean for the next person."<br>
>>>>> >>>><br>
>>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________<br>
>>>>> >>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list<br>
>>>>> >>>> <a href="mailto:Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net">Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
>>>>> >>>> <a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss</a><br>
>>>>> >>><br>
>>>>> >>><br>
>>>>> >>> _______________________________________________<br>
>>>>> >>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list<br>
>>>>> >>> <a href="mailto:Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net">Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
>>>>> >>> <a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss</a><br>
>>>>> >><br>
>>>>> >><br>
>>>>> >> _______________________________________________<br>
>>>>> >> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list<br>
>>>>> >> <a href="mailto:Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net">Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
>>>>> >> <a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss</a><br>
>>>>> ><br>
>>>>> ><br>
>>>>> ><br>
>>>>> > --<br>
>>>>> > Naomi Theora Most<br>
>>>>> > <a href="mailto:naomi@nthmost.com">naomi@nthmost.com</a><br>
>>>>> > <a href="tel:%2B1-415-728-7490" value="+14157287490">+1-415-728-7490</a><br>
>>>>> ><br>
>>>>> > skype: nthmost<br>
>>>>> ><br>
>>>>> > <a href="http://twitter.com/nthmost" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/nthmost</a><br>
>>>>> _______________________________________________<br>
>>>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list<br>
>>>>> <a href="mailto:Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net">Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
>>>>> <a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss</a><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> _______________________________________________<br>
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>>>> <a href="mailto:Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net">Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
>>>> <a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss</a><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> _______________________________________________<br>
>>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list<br>
>>>> <a href="mailto:Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net">Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
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>>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> _______________________________________________<br>
>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list<br>
>>> <a href="mailto:Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net">Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
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>>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> _______________________________________________<br>
>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list<br>
>> <a href="mailto:Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net">Noisebridge-discuss@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
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>><br>
><br>
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><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
Naomi Theora Most<br>
<a href="mailto:naomi@nthmost.com">naomi@nthmost.com</a><br>
<a href="tel:%2B1-415-728-7490" value="+14157287490">+1-415-728-7490</a><br>
<br>
skype: nthmost<br>
<br>
<a href="http://twitter.com/nthmost" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/nthmost</a><br>
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</blockquote></div>