<div dir="ltr">Technically your ginger beer plant's alcohol strength is based on the tolerance of the strongest yeast strain within it. So you could conceivably hit good wine strengths. <div><br></div><div style>I think though, that at the higher end of the ABV levels, it might make your culture a bit unviable.</div>
<div style><br></div><div style>All this talk of ginger beer makes me think that I should start a culture. Ginger is cheap here. If you are not making beer with it, you can bake bread too.</div></div><div class="gmail_extra">
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Mar 7, 2013 at 9:41 AM, Frantisek Apfelbeck <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:algoldor@yahoo.com" target="_blank">algoldor@yahoo.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div><div style="font-size:10pt;font-family:bookman old style,new york,times,serif"><div><span>Beautiful! I had a just a meeting which part was proposal for building a small pilot fermentation facility. Now I'm coming back home and I'm looking forward to have more questions and talk about your and others experiments in next few days. I did not know that the ginger beer plant makes alcohol at such a concentration, my one was very low on ethanol. Concerning tamarind, amazing, I really love it for flavouring, the rest I will comment and talk about later on.</span></div>
<div><span></span> </div>
<div><span>Sincerely,</span></div>
<div></div>
<div> </div>
<div>Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck</div>
<div></div>
<div> </div>
<div>PS I am very slowly working on a project of experimental incubator one of the purposes is to make soy beans based ferments like tempeh, miso, nato etc.<var></var><br></div><div class="im">
<div>biotechnologist&kvasir and hacker</div><br>
<div><br></div>
<div><a href="http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org" target="_blank">http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org</a></div>
<div><br><br></div>
</div><div><div class="im">"There is no way to peace, peace is the way." Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi<br><br>
</div><div style="FONT-FAMILY:bookman old style,new york,times,serif;FONT-SIZE:10pt">
<div style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman,new york,times,serif;FONT-SIZE:12pt">
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Arial">
<div style="BORDER-BOTTOM:#ccc 1px solid;BORDER-LEFT:#ccc 1px solid;PADDING-BOTTOM:0px;LINE-HEIGHT:0;MARGIN:5px 0px;PADDING-LEFT:0px;PADDING-RIGHT:0px;min-height:0px;FONT-SIZE:0px;BORDER-TOP:#ccc 1px solid;BORDER-RIGHT:#ccc 1px solid;PADDING-TOP:0px" readonly>
</div><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold">From:</span></b> Lewis Scaife <<a href="mailto:lewis.scaife@gmail.com" target="_blank">lewis.scaife@gmail.com</a>><br><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold">To:</span></b> Frantisek Apfelbeck <<a href="mailto:algoldor@yahoo.com" target="_blank">algoldor@yahoo.com</a>> <br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold">Cc:</span></b> "<a href="mailto:tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net" target="_blank">tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net" target="_blank">tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net</a>> <br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold">Sent:</span></b> Thursday, March 7, 2013 2:02 PM<br><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: Tastebridge Digest, Vol 32, Issue 3<br></font></div><br>
<div><div class="im">
<div dir="ltr">hey, Frantisek and all - nice to read about your brewing escapades.
<div><br></div>
<div>surprisingly, the ginger beer plant product was more alcoholic than most beer, by my very scientific "estimation of inebriation." i purchased my plant from the source you reference (judging by the price) and enjoyed working with it - though it is more labor intensive than kombucha. my plant never really grew - possibly because my room temperature is too cool. i am considering building a larger incubator - i have a small one for tempeh and lactic acid ferments.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>the beer was great. i made a couple varieties - plain old ginger, galangal + kefir lime leaf and thai chili, and an apple cider beer. they were all delicious but i had unpredictable success with carbonation. </div>
<div><br></div>
<div>the most recent of my competing interests has been flavoring kombucha vinegar. i'm making tamarind, galangal, ginger, thai chili, lemongrass, star anise, mint, and thai basil. </div>
<div><br></div>
<div><img width="420" height="317"><br></div>
<div><br></div></div>
</div><div><br><br>
<div><div class="im">On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 5:15 PM, Frantisek Apfelbeck <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:algoldor@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">algoldor@yahoo.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
</div><blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT:#ccc 1px solid;MARGIN:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;PADDING-LEFT:1ex">
<div>
<div style="FONT-FAMILY:bookman old style,new york,times,serif;FONT-SIZE:10pt"><div class="im">
<div style="FONT-SIZE:10pt"><span>Hi Lewis&all,</span></div>
<div style="BACKGROUND-COLOR:transparent;FONT-STYLE:normal;FONT-SIZE:13px"><span>Sounds really nice, I was thinking about getting this culture already but did not because of high cost (I could kind of efford it, but I do not agree with the high price from my point of view - more than 20 or 25 EU for starting culture).</span></div>
<div style="FONT-SIZE:10pt"></div>
<div style="FONT-SIZE:10pt"> </div>
<div><font size="+0">The ginger beer which you made based on ginger beer plant is mostly non alcoholic right? I do non alcoholic ginger beers based on kombucha, water kefir and milk kefir whey, I like especially ones from dark brown sugar, of course if I can effort I love honey base ...</font></div>
<div><font size="+0"><br></font></div>
<div><font size="+0">Anyway please let me know how is it with the alcohol content based on ginger beer plant flavour and many thanks for tip!</font></div>
<div><font size="+0"><br></font></div>
<div><font size="+0">Sincerely,</font></div>
<div style="FONT-SIZE:10pt"><br></div>
<div style="FONT-SIZE:10pt">Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck<br><br></div>
<div style="BACKGROUND-COLOR:transparent;FONT-STYLE:normal;FONT-SIZE:13px">PS I was "house sitting" the ginger beer plant culture for a friend in Seoul for three weeks and one of the batches which I done was really beautiful, one of the most tasty ferments which I have done till now ...</div>
<div style="BACKGROUND-COLOR:transparent;FONT-STYLE:normal;FONT-SIZE:13px"><br></div>
<div style="FONT-SIZE:10pt">biotechnologist&kvasir and hacker</div><br><br>
</div><div style="FONT-SIZE:10pt"><a href="http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org/</a></div>
<div style="FONT-SIZE:10pt"><br><br></div>
<div style="FONT-SIZE:10pt"><div class="im">"There is no way to peace, peace is the way." Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi<br><br>
</div><div style="FONT-SIZE:10pt">
<div style="FONT-SIZE:12pt"><div><div class="h5">
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</div><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold">From:</span></b> "<a href="mailto:tastebridge-request@lists.noisebridge.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">tastebridge-request@lists.noisebridge.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:tastebridge-request@lists.noisebridge.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">tastebridge-request@lists.noisebridge.net</a>><br>
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<br><br>Today's Topics:<br><br> 1. Re: suggestions for alcoholic ginger beer experiments<br> (Lewis Scaife)<br><br><br>----------------------------------------------------------------------<br><br>Message: 1<br>
Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 13:40:48 -0800<br>From: Lewis Scaife <<a href="mailto:lewis.scaife@gmail.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">lewis.scaife@gmail.com</a>><br>Cc: tastebridge tastebridge <<a href="mailto:tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [Tastebridge] suggestions for alcoholic ginger beer<br> experiments<br>Message-ID:<br> <<a href="mailto:CAOaAozZ5UpdrzRdRnb3dMVMBJDgvdCPsze4Zhv9a67W_Hg2yRw@mail.gmail.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">CAOaAozZ5UpdrzRdRnb3dMVMBJDgvdCPsze4Zhv9a67W_Hg2yRw@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<br><br>regarding ginger beer, i spent much of 2012 making gb using an authentic gb<br>plant.<br>highly recommended over yeasted versions.<br><br><br>On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 4:24 AM, Richard Conroy <<a href="mailto:richard.conroy@gmail.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">richard.conroy@gmail.com</a>>wrote:<br>
<br>> Hi Frantisek,<br>> I have done quite a lot of alcoholic ferments using ginger, and started<br>> out much the same as the way you did. I have since moved on to making my<br>> ginger beer with malt extract/all grain, and hopping it just like any other<br>
> beer.<br>><br>> Also using honey rather than refined sugar is another trick that I really<br>> like, I use it for honey ginger wines where I want to have a higher alcohol<br>> strength beverage (~8-10% ABV). Ginger + Honey + Red soft fruits & berries<br>
> (especially plums) = AWESOME.<br>><br>> Standard advice with alcoholic ferments is to ferment until complete and<br>> resweeten/prime when the yeast is done. The higher the strength, the longer<br>> you will need to leave it age and develop flavour, but they also preserve<br>
> longer. You will need a
hydrometer/refractometer. If you bottle too early<br>> you can get some interesting bottle bombs.<br>><br>> Many of the components of ginger, including its fieryness are in my<br>> experience very volatile, and blow out your airlock when you do alcoholic<br>
> ferments.<br>><br>> I am thinking of trying to introduce more of it at batch priming time<br>> instead (but I dont do batch priming currently). The theory is that you add<br>> your priming sugar into a solution, and siphon your ferment onto it. Leave<br>
> until it fully mixes and then bottle with that. Your priming solution can<br>> contain more than just water, and you can use it to introduce flavour kicks<br>> or volatile aromas lost during fermentation. Haven't tested this yet.<br>
><br>> I have haphazardly taken down odd notes and photos here:<br>> <a href="https://www.facebook.com/The.Sum.of.all.Beers" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.facebook.com/The.Sum.of.all.Beers</a><br>><br>
> Been meaning to store this in somewhere more ordered, but life is a bit<br>> too busy at the moment.<br>><br>><br>><br>><br>><br>><br>> On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 8:14 AM, Frantisek Apfelbeck <<a href="mailto:algoldor@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">algoldor@yahoo.com</a>>wrote:<br>
><br>>> Hi Michael,<br>>> Many thanks for tips! I will get back to your email most likely tomorrow.<br>>> Just for now I've relocated to South Korea, specifically to the island<br>>> called Jeju. Beautiful location but I have not found a brewing shop here<br>
>> yet so I have to be minimalistic.<br>>><br>>> Anyway talk to you more tomorrow and once more thanks for your tips.<br>>><br>>> Sincerely,<br>>><br>>> Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck<br>
>><br>>>
biotechnologist&kvasir and hacker<br>>><br>>><br></div></div>>> <a href="http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org/</a><div><div class="h5">
<br>>><br>>><br>>> "There is no way to peace, peace is the way." Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi<br>>><br>>> ------------------------------<br>>> *From:* Michael Lyons <<a href="mailto:cprmichael@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">cprmichael@yahoo.com</a>><br>
>> *To:* Frantisek Apfelbeck <<a href="mailto:algoldor@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">algoldor@yahoo.com</a>><br>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 5, 2013 3:46 PM<br>>> *Subject:* Re: [Tastebridge] suggestions for alcoholic ginger beer<br>
>> experiments<br>>><br>>> Thanks for asking. I've have quite a bit of experience brewing though<br>>> hardly
consider myself to be an expert. I applaud you for brewing an<br>>> alcoholic drink that is not beer. Personally, I stopped brewing beer a few<br>>> years ago when the price of ingredients doubled and it became cost<br>
>> prohibitive for me.<br>>><br>>> First of all, there are many reasons to not use baking yeast, and many<br>>> types of yeast to choose from which have different qualities you can take<br>>> advantage of. One of these qualities is the alcohol concentration at which<br>
>> the yeast attenuates ie. stops functioning. Another quality is how well<br>>> the dead yeast flocculate and settle out of the liquid.<br>>><br>>> Another substance you might want to consider is Yeast Nutrient, which is<br>
>> inexpensive. I have used it when I have brewed hard cider, which doesn't<br>>> have the natural nutrients that beer wort does.<br>>> The quantity of yeast
you use is not particularly relevant since the<br>>> yeasties multiply and theoretically one yeast cell could (eventually)<br>>> ferment any amount of beverage. Asking at brew shop is a good idea.<br>>> Also keep in mind that yeast are reusable, so you can save some of the<br>
>> used yeast in a suitable, airlocked bottle. A really fun thing to do is<br>>> to have a fresh batch ready for ferment when you siphon off the finished<br>>> brew off the old yeast. Dump the fresh batch on top of the old yeast and it<br>
>> will take off full bore in an couple of hours.<br>>><br>>> As for adjusting the sweetness, I suggest using a non-fermenting<br>>> sweetener, like stevia or lactose. I remember having a problem with a cider<br>
>> I made that would not stop fermenting. I had let it ferment until the yeast<br>>> stopped, but it ended up tasting incredibly dry. When I added more sugar
to<br>>> get the right sweetness, the yeast would re-activate and within a week or<br>>> two the sugar would be gone and the cider would be too dry again.<br>>><br>>> If you are using brown sugar for flavor, remember that it is white sugar<br>
>> mixed with molasses, and you might as well use white sugar and add molasses<br>>> for flavor.<br>>><br>>> Speaking of flavorings, it is often best to add them after the<br>>> fermentation. When I tried making a cherry cider, all of my great cherry<br>
>> flavor I'd added before fermenting went up in the bubbles my yeast gave<br>>> off while it was working on the sugar during fermentation.<br>>><br>>> As for water, remember that Anchor brewery and I think speakeasy too, use<br>
>> straight SF tap water. Fine product from Hetch Hetchy. Great taste and fine<br>>> to brew with. Chlorine & flouride and inconsequential no
need to filter,<br>>> sanitize or mess with the water from the tap; "they" already do that.<br>>><br>>> As for fermentation vessels, most people I know use either 5 gallon food<br>>> grade plastic buckets with lids or glass carboys. Fermentation locks are<br>
>> necessary to keep out bacteria and errant yeast, especially during the<br>>> later stages of the fermentation when the yeast is not throwing off so much<br>>> CO2. Many of us rig up a blow off tube for the first part of the<br>
>> fermentation because ordinary locks can get clogged with vigorously<br>>> bubbling yeast and blow out..<br>>> Fyi, we have all this gear at Noisebridge.<br>>><br>>> I have no idea what temperature 25C is, but the nice thing about living<br>
>> where we do is that yeast like it too. 60-70F. I would be leery of using a<br>>> submersible pump, since the brew is not
circulating and you're likely to<br>>> get part of the batch too hot. Traditionally we keep blankets around the<br>>> brewing vessel and they make electrically heated wraps for fermentation<br>>> containers.<br>
>><br>>> Well that's my two cents. Good luck and let me know if you have any more<br>>> questions or would like any other help.<br>>><br>>> -michaeLyons<br>>><br>>> ------------------------------<br>
>> *From:* Frantisek Apfelbeck <<a href="mailto:algoldor@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">algoldor@yahoo.com</a>><br>>> *To:* "<a href="mailto:foodhackingbase@lists.hackerspaces.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">foodhackingbase@lists.hackerspaces.org</a>" <<br>
>> <a href="mailto:foodhackingbase@lists.hackerspaces.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">foodhackingbase@lists.hackerspaces.org</a>>; tastebridge tastebridge <<br>>> <a href="mailto:tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net</a>>; 091 Foods <<a href="mailto:091-food@googlegroups.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">091-food@googlegroups.com</a>><br>
>><br>>> *Sent:* Monday, March 4, 2013 5:06 PM<br>>> *Subject:* [Tastebridge] suggestions for alcoholic ginger beer<br>>> experiments<br>>><br>>> Hi to all and to alcoholic brewers especially,<br>
>> I just started a new experiment aiming to brew nice alcoholic ginger beer<br>>> and I have some questions below. My first batch will be most likely too<br>>> sweet, but it is the max end of the screening which I want to do (on
the<br>>> sweet side), the details for the first experiment are below. I would like<br>>> to ask for recommendations for the next experiments, I put some ideas below<br>>> at the end. It is possible that I may be able to sell the final product, of<br>
>> course I plan to share the technology, recopies etc.<br>>><br>>> The final volume of the brew = 5 l; Specifications:<br>>><br>>> 0.1% (w/v; 5 g) of bakers dried instant yeast (primed/activated in warm<br>
>> water with bit of light brown sugar for +-30 min)<br>>> 20% (w/v; 1000 g) of light brown sugar (dissolved in hot water)<br>>> 4%(w/v; 200 g) of ginger (fresh, cleaned by brush and blended in mixer,<br>
>> added to the brew at the beginning of fermentation)<br>>> 95% of used water is commercial purified water (I shake it a bit to get<br>>> some oxygen in it)<br>>> fermentation vessel is 5 l plastic container,
narrow mouth, closed by<br>>> lid, no air lock at the momment<br>>> the brew is fermenting at +-25C in my "aquarium heater" based incubator<br>>><br>>> It started to go on within few hours and it is fermenting really<br>
>> strongly, anaerobic fermentation as mentioned. I tasted it yesterday (two<br>>> days after starting) and it is quite sweet still and bit alcoholic. I am<br>>> thinking about starting another brews under same conditions changing just<br>
>> the sugar concentration to 15% and 10%(w/v). What do you think about that?<br>>> Below are more ideas, please do remember that I do not have too much<br>>> experience with alcoholic fermentations. Also I ferment in the same<br>
>> environment all my probiotics but I am using the clean newly bought plastic<br>>> vessels for the alcoholic ginger beer.<br>>><br>>> THE NEXT EXPERIMENTS - Ideas and suggestions<br>>> -
decreasing the level of sugar concentrations to 10 and 15% (w/v; 500<br>>> and 750 g respectively)<br>>> - changing the type of sugar for completely white sugar (which may be an<br>>> issue concerning the nutrition for the yeast) resulting in more clear<br>
>> gingery flavour<br>>> - changing the type of sugar for dark rich brown sugar resulting in<br>>> more heavy complex flavour because of molasses<br>>> - changing the amount of yeast added to a lower concentration<br>
>> to decrease the possibly off flavour<br>>> - increasing the concentration of ginger and maybe processing it with<br>>> heat, which would result in more "spicy flavour" due to the transformation<br>
>> of gingerol to more pungent zingerone<br>>> <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gingerol" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gingerol</a><br>>> - more ideas?<br>>><br>
>> I
should mention that I do not have access to any specific yeast now, I'm<br>>> bit low on cash, otherwise what strains would you recommend? I heard nice<br>>> thinks about California Ale yeast but I'm not sure if it would be suitable.<br>
>> Maybe some more "cider" style yeast would be better?<br>>><br>>> Many thanks for any ideas, I will be in touch within next few days with<br>>> few news :-)<br>>><br>>> Sincerely,<br>
>><br>>> FAA<br>>><br>>> PS I have made another batch of kimchi yesterday from Chinese cabbage,<br>>> miso, fish souse, ginger and garlic so I'm really looking forward for the<br>>> results.<br>
>><br>>> Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck<br>>><br>>> biotechnologist&kvasir and hacker<br>>><br>>><br></div></div>>> <a href="http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org/</a><div class="im">
<br>>><br>>><br>>> "There is no way to peace, peace is the way." Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi<br>>><br>>> _______________________________________________<br>>> Tastebridge mailing list<br>
>> <a href="mailto:Tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>>> <a href="https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/tastebridge" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/tastebridge</a><br>
>><br>>><br>>><br>>><br>>><br>>> _______________________________________________<br>>> Tastebridge mailing list<br>>> <a href="mailto:Tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Tastebridge@lists.noisebridge.net</a><br>
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