[Noisebridge-discuss] The future of Python class at Noisebridge

jim jim at systemateka.com
Tue Oct 5 19:36:49 UTC 2010


   I love the idea of little tests, maybe very small 
(fifteen-minute) feature-specific hands-on exercises 
and maybe some alternate problems that are meatier 
(I'm not much into games; I like the idea of working 
with third-party modules). 



On Tue, 2010-10-05 at 12:22 -0700, Laura Khalil wrote:
> Hey Adit,
> 
> 
> I took Dan's class when he just got on board (over a year ago) and
> really enjoyed it. I haven't been back in an age, but glad to hear
> you're thinking of keeping it alive.
> 
> 
> One thing about Invent with Python: Al does a great job of giving an
> overview of Python. However, the book is written for kids, so
> everything is spelled out -- there's little to challenge the adult
> user to try and figure things out on his own. Personally, I find this
> critical to my understanding of a programming language.
> 
> 
> I still think it's a great book, but may be better served if it could
> be supplemented with test questions/homework problems to apply what's
> learned.
> 
> 
> Laura
> 
> On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 11:36 AM, aditya bhargava
> <aditya at wefoundland.com> wrote:
>         Mark himself has said that Dive Into Python has become
>         outdated and he hasn't had time to update it. I was thinking
>         of going with Al's book for this class. Game dev looks like a
>         popular way of getting into coding and I think it's because of
>         the payoff at the end where you get to play your own game. I
>         looked over the book and it has the kind of projects that
>         people would sincerely enjoy working on. Overall I think we
>         will have the most fun with that book.
>         
>         I'm picturing the class as a beginner's intro to programming,
>         with Python as the language of choice and Invent With Python
>         as the book of choice. I'm down for running the classes. If
>         anyone else is interested in tag-teaming it, or if people want
>         to come and talk about specialized topics intermittently, I
>         would be down for that too.
>         
>         Daniel, I have questions for you about what you've covered so
>         far...maybe we should take that conversation off the NB
>         mailing list?
>         
>         
>         Adit
>         
>         
>         
>         
>         On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 11:06 AM, jim <jim at systemateka.com>
>         wrote:
>                 
>                 Many thanks.
>                 
>                 
>                 
>                 On Tue, 2010-10-05 at 10:21 -0700, Daniel C.
>                 Silverstein wrote:
>                 > The examples in Dive Into Python are needlessly
>                 complex, and, in some
>                 > cases, hopelessly outdated.  Also, like Think
>                 Python, I find the order
>                 > of topics to be questionable.
>                 >
>                 > Zed Shaw has an amusing and vitriolic rant re: Dive
>                 Into Python here:
>                 > http://oppugn.us/posts/1272050135.html
>                 > I don't necessarily agree with the entire rant, but
>                 I agree with the
>                 > spirit of it.
>                 >
>                 > (Dan)
>                 >
>                 > On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 10:15 AM, jim
>                 <jim at systemateka.com> wrote:
>                 > >
>                 > > I'd love to know your take on Dive into Python.
>                 > > Can you summarize?
>                 > >
>                 > >
>                 > > On Tue, 2010-10-05 at 09:30 -0700, Daniel C.
>                 Silverstein wrote:
>                 > >> I should point out that, over time, I became
>                 dissatisfied with Think
>                 > >> Python and Dive into Python.  I have not used
>                 Al's book so I can't
>                 > >> comment on it for good or bad.  More recently
>                 I've been using the
>                 > >> Google Python Class curriculum available here:
>                 > >>
>                 http://code.google.com/edu/languages/google-python-class/
>                 > >>
>                 > >> (Dan)
>                 > >>
>                 > >> On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 8:13 AM, jim
>                 <jim at well.com> wrote:
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> >   The Monday night Python class began as a
>                 SF-LUG Python
>                 > >> > study group with Asheesh as mentor. Asheesh
>                 left the
>                 > >> > region to set up openhatch.org and Daniel took
>                 over,
>                 > >> > formalizing the meeting somewhat as a class
>                 with teacher,
>                 > >> > and has hung in there for over a year.
>                 > >> >   You can change the approach as you see fit.
>                 You might
>                 > >> > take it on with someone else to share the
>                 mentoring or
>                 > >> > lecture role or revert to study group format by
>                 reducing
>                 > >> > the role of the mentor or whatever. If you
>                 share the role,
>                 > >> > you have the plus side of better continuity
>                 (each mentor
>                 > >> > can take a break) but the with price of keeping
>                 in sync
>                 > >> > with each other. There's at least one other NB
>                 member
>                 > >> > who's got very good Python skills with an
>                 aptitude for
>                 > >> > teaching.
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> >   I believe there are two main aspects to
>                 support:
>                 > >> > * provide real-world, simple examples that
>                 demand that
>                 > >> >  attendees think out the problem solution in
>                 terms of
>                 > >> >  Python language features and Pythonic
>                 techniques.
>                 > >> > * accommodate stone beginners and also people
>                 who are
>                 > >> >  approaching intermediate levels. The Dive into
>                 Python
>                 > >> >  book is available on line and might work for
>                 both
>                 > >> >  groups. Al Sweigart's book, Invent Your Own
>                 Computer
>                 > >> >  Games with Python, is currently in the Turing
>                 room
>                 > >> >  and I believe has been used in the Python
>                 class; it's
>                 > >> >  certainly suitable for beginners and to some
>                 degree
>                 > >> >  to extending Python skills. The book that
>                 Asheesh
>                 > >> >  first chose as a basis for the group is Python
>                 for
>                 > >> >  Software Design: How to Think Like a Computer
>                 > >> >  Scientist and for a while, at least, Daniel
>                 stuck
>                 > >> >  with it.
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> > http://diveintopython.org/
>                 > >> > http://inventwithpython.com/
>                 > >> > http://www.greenteapress.com/thinkpython/
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> >   (my opinions: ) I and a few others have had
>                 some
>                 > >> > objections to parts of the Think Python text.
>                 I'd not use
>                 > >> > it in favor of Al's book and Dive into Python.
>                 > >> >   I think sticking to the current schedule
>                 (Monday
>                 > >> > evenings from 6:30 to 8:00) is important.
>                 > >> >   There are several Python groups in the bay
>                 area, and
>                 > >> > one or more of their members might be willing
>                 to share
>                 > >> > the leader role or come in for an occasional
>                 lecture or
>                 > >> > point you to examples at times you find your
>                 own well dry.
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> > http://www.pygamesf.org/
>                 > >> > http://www.pywebsf.org/
>                 > >> > http://www.baypiggies.net/
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> > On Mon, 2010-10-04 at 23:56 -0700, aditya
>                 bhargava wrote:
>                 > >> >> I have a fair amount of experience in the
>                 language, but I've never
>                 > >> >> been to one of these classes. What are they
>                 usually like? I can
>                 > >> >> volunteer to make up cheat sheets or talk
>                 about specialized topics if
>                 > >> >> there's interest in that. Off the top of my
>                 head, I could talk about:
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >> - scientific computing in Python
>                 > >> >> - working with Django
>                 > >> >> - writing modules in C++ using Boost::Python
>                 and other alternatives
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >> Adit
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >> On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 10:11 PM, Daniel C.
>                 Silverstein
>                 > >> >> <cubes at ghosthacked.net> wrote:
>                 > >> >>         Howdy,
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>         Would anyone be interested in taking
>                 over teaching Python
>                 > >> >>         class at
>                 > >> >>         Noisebridge going forward?  Python is
>                 one of the longest
>                 > >> >>         running
>                 > >> >>         classes at Noisebridge, and I've
>                 personally been teaching it
>                 > >> >>         for the
>                 > >> >>         better part of the last year and a
>                 half.  I think it may be
>                 > >> >>         time for
>                 > >> >>         me to move on to other pursuits, but
>                 I'd rather not see the
>                 > >> >>         class die.
>                 > >> >>          Historically, Python class has been
>                 on Monday evenings from
>                 > >> >>         6:30 to
>                 > >> >>         8:00, but if anyone is interested in
>                 teaching it, I'm sure
>                 > >> >>         he/she
>                 > >> >>         would be welcome to reschedule.
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>         (Dan)
>                 > >> >>
>                 _______________________________________________
>                 > >> >>         Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>                 > >> >>
>                 Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>                 > >> >>
>                 https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >>
>                 > >> >> --
>                 > >> >> wefoundland.com
>                 > >> >>
>                 _______________________________________________
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>                 > >> >> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>                 > >> >>
>                 https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> >
>                 > >> _______________________________________________
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>                 > >
>                 > >
>                 
>                 
>         
>         
>         
>         
>         -- 
>         wefoundland.com
>         
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