[Noisebridge-discuss] more about the attempted theft

[Ever Falling]

so the issue is that there's no clear procedure in handling a thief? Isn't
there a way to detain someone under citizens arrest? How is this a liability
issue for the space?

On Thu, Jun 9, 2011 at 3:53 PM, Patrick Lake <pat at patsanimation.com> wrote:

> Here's a follow up.
>
> Story:  I looked up from cooking and saw a guy I had never seen before
> wearing my jacket, going through my bag, putting his laptop in it with mine,
> and zipping up to leave.  I grabbed the bag and yelled for a couple members
> I know and we started questioning him.  He couldn't say anything that made
> sense (quoting him "It was a mistake, it was a prank because I'm a hacker
> and that's what we do, I thought my brother gave me the bag for a gift,"
> etc.)  Some members separated me and they spent a long time questioning him.
>  That really sucked to wait an hour without resolution, thinking he was
> going to get up and run away any minute (a pro thief would have).  It was
> tough for me to give that much respect to Noisebridge over my wish to get
> something done.  Eventually I got an OK to call cops to meet downstairs.
>  They couldn't do anything and the guy was free to leave.
>
> The day after, it's easier for me to understand the guy's behavior probably
> came from real mental illness.  I didn't treat it that way at the time for
> several reasons.
> - It was just so freaky and upsetting.
> - I didn't have a lot of time alone with the guy to see him show symptoms.
> - I had never personally seen a manic/bipolar episode like that.
> - I already brought up a specific security worry to another member the day
> before.
> - the handling by Noisebridge was a lot different than it would have been
> in another setting, and the process wasn't clear.
>
> I went up to the line of threatening to physically restrain the guy myself.
>  I was afraid that people wouldn't help me stop him from leaving.  Yeah I
> was told you can't legally do that, it's a liability, whatever.  I didn't
> and don't give a shit about risking arrest for beating a thief.  Especially
> when the response by cops has serious limits on what they can do.  I already
> knew that and as expected this guy wasn't charged.
>
> I asked the cops to give me a few minutes, to tell him how fucked up it was
> that he tried to rob me.  I couldn't get a single bit of remorse or
> responsibility from him, and that was the worst part.
>
> In my adrenaline filled pissed-offedness, I went home and emailed the guy's
> professional contacts.  This morning I got a call from HR at his employer.
>  They apologized on his behalf.  I told them I was satisfied the message got
> to somebody and they cared enough to respond, so I can consider it settled.
>  I added that I felt more understanding today, and if mental illness was the
> cause, I hope the guy is not fired because of my message.  That was going
> out there to make consequences, but it's better for him than getting a rap
> sheet that would follow him.
>
> I still want to add photos and another write up of this to the page (please
> let me know if there's a good place for it.)
>
> More points about the collective response by Noisebridge.
>
> -  You might know cases where crime victims get their rights fucked because
> they let "non-cops" handle justice.  Like, private security guards or
> college campus security.  Example, how colleges handle rape complaints.  The
> solution to save your rights is call the real cops and fuck the internal
> process.  I wanted to keep my rights and that's why I was intent on getting
> cops.  Nevertheless, Noisebridge got an hour to handle things before I did.
>  Waiting time was an issue by itself.
>
> - While this was going down I didn't know what the process should be.  I
> was afraid that nobody would help me restrain the guy, or join me to stand
> by the door so he wouldn't even think about running.  When shit is going
> down, if people are ready to do that without a second thought, it would
> help.
>
> - The laptop held everything for my business, and as far as I know, no
> insurance would have protected my livelihood.  Not my own, and none from
> Noisebridge.  Seems like it might be a liability concern for the whole
> place.
>
> - What if the cops use an emergency call as a pretext to go in there and
> bust it up without a search warrant.  I understand why there can be civil
> liberties worries, and people (especially at a collective space) have
> different opinions about how to interact with the system.  Briefing people
> about the big picture is good.
>
> It ended OK, but if the guy was a pro, it wouldn't have.  That's all.
>
> thanks, Pat
>
>
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