[Noisebridge-discuss] XY Combinator

Tue May 24 18:28:51 UTC 2011

Interesting reactions. While everything everyone said is intelligent and I
generally agree with it, I think some people are taking this way too
seriously. Yes, this implies only men do startups, which is totally untrue.
Yes, this implies all smart men are datable, which is untrue. Yes, it
implies several things that are untrue, and hopefully we're all smart enough
to know that those things are untrue.

To me this is the standard "nerds can't get girls" joke, and I think its an
amusing and implementation. Especially since I follow the startup scene and
read about Y-Combinator every day. I also think its completely harmless.

All the arguments against it are arguments against politically incorrect
humor as a whole, and I disagree with the idea that every joke has to be
respectful of everybody. We need to be able to say things we think are funny
without having to make sure that every part of their content and everything
their content implies is completely factually accurate and fair. That would
be terrible. We need to be able to ignore some of the facts of a situation
and just laugh at it. I think that is a really important core human need.

That doesn't mean I think ignoring womens/mens/blacks/whites/etc's rights is
okay, I just think we need to hold our culture to a higher standard. We
shouldn't expect people's thoughts to be binary and unchanging. We should
expect people to be smart enough to know when something is a joke and when
it isn't. I understand that that's expecting a lot. People are bad at
filtering everything out, and there is some risk that it will get to their
head. But when it comes time to make real decisions, they should know what
thoughts are theirs and how they truly feel about something. I tell rape
jokes all the time (yes, you hate me now if you didn't already), but I also
fight strongly for women's rights and equality. I think rape is a terrible
terrible thing and its pervasiveness is completely unacceptable. But I still
appreciate ignoring all that stuff and just joking about it. Louis CK tells
a joke about raping Hitler that's hilarious. I joke a lot about racism, but
only because I think racism is so completely dumb that the people who still
are racist just seem comically out of touch to me (though the way they
behave obviously isn't comical).

My point is, I don't want to live in a society where you can't tell a
harmless "nerds can't get girls joke" without being accused of perpetuating
our rape culture and objectifying women. Those issues are incredibly
important, but finding them in a harmless joke like this, in my opinion, is
taking things way too far. (Its also probably an ineffective way of getting
your message out)

<Steals flame suit from interpetive arson>
-Taylor

On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 10:32 AM, Ken Adler <ken.adler at gmail.com> wrote:

> I wonder how long that picture on the home page stays there.  Anyone want
> to start a betting pool?
>
> I know one of the guys in the picture and gave him the heads up about the
> site.   He  (a) was not aware of the site,and (b) was "not amused" that his
> picture was being used without his permission.. especially in this context.
>
> Ken
>
>
> On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 9:46 AM, Tom Cauchois <tcauchois at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> This is an example of something that's hard to pick up on for guys who
>> have never really thought about it, because I don't think it's trying to be
>> offensive.  It's just trying to make fun of startup founders.
>>
>> The part that makes it obvious, and the part that really annoys me, is
>> again "all startup founders are guys and we need to get them dates through
>> the internet".  That's a denial of the great women in tech and a
>> discouragement for more women to enter tech.  Maybe low impact because it's
>> a joke site, but it's also the pervasive thinking, which sucks because a
>> gender balanced tech workforce would be sweet.
>>
>> It also implies these guys are dateable, in spite of "The Social Network".
>>
>> On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 3:03 AM, Christie Dudley <longobord at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 12:10 AM, Griffin Boyce <griffinboyce at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> I would think in this case that the guys would be the "commodity" since
>>>> they are the ones vying for the affection of those who are considered to be
>>>> socially-superior.
>>>>
>>>
>>> uh... no, not really. When you seek money for your startup, it's the
>>> money that's the commodity, not the unique original idea that you have. Last
>>> I checked, the whole point of money is that it's a commodity.
>>>
>>> I found the whole thing more sad than funny. It seemed a lame attempt at
>>> humor, relying on stereotypes (thus reinforcing them) to make a joke that at
>>> best was really childish, like laughing at a disabled kid for not being able
>>> to play ball like normal kids. Not only do I agree with Liz about the
>>> assumption that it's only men doing startups, but entirely found the
>>> treatment of women on that site uncomfortable. Although I suspect they meant
>>> it to be creepy, it is neither truly over the top, nor not-creepy, thus
>>> failing on either side.
>>>
>>> They might have been able to pull it out with interesting embellishment
>>> or even meaningful credibility, but failed there, too. I mean seriously, no
>>> feedback form? Just an email address? You never got to know anything about
>>> the girls, not even how they select them. They could have taken that
>>> humorously quite a long ways, potentially making the women seem even *gasp*
>>> desirable in any way at all other than "lovely young". But by that omission,
>>> they so thoroughly commoditize the women, they assure that it falls flat.
>>> (They seriously would do better with cattle!)
>>>
>>>
>>>> To me at least, it's coded as access to romance and basic human
>>>> affection, which (again in my experience) isn't limited to "access to a
>>>> vagina."  In fact, it's incredibly insulting that it's so frequently assumed
>>>> that "all men want" is sexual interaction.  And yes, I've met (and
>>>> frequently dated!) men who were exceedingly polite and respectful, but were
>>>> too shy in most circumstances to make a good first impression.  The same
>>>> goes for women, come to think of it.  Something like this could be a good
>>>> way to meet people for all genders and sexualities.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Oh, and I guess you missed the FAQ where they tell you they don't offer
>>> boys to date. "Our model works best." was their response. It makes
>>>
>>> I think the biggest reason the joke here falls flat is because it's not
>>> even outrageous enough that it's clear to people who read it through that
>>> it's a joke. Or maybe that's the joke?
>>>
>>> Christie
>>> _______
>>> I'm the kind of person who finds and makes choices where there appear to
>>> be none.
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>
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>
>
> --
> Ken Adler
> 510-290-5806 (cell)
> Ken at adler.net
> ----
>
>
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