[Noisebridge-discuss] banning "Occupy"

Tue Feb 14 21:40:16 UTC 2012

I have been making suggestions on how to begin dealing, as a group, in the
emails I have been writing. They are not prescriptive, but suggestive and
open-ended, in the hopes of soliciting opinions, feedback, and further
input from the community.  If you didn't notice, because of the way many of
us look for fully-baked answers to be handed out without any input, well,
maybe you should go reread my messages and think about the ideas I put into
them, and the directions I suggest.

An approach to problem solving that happens on this list all the time, that
I see you modeling here, is sort of problematic. You are stating a
prescriptive solution to a communal problem, and then creating a conceptual
framework where what you have proposed is a communal solution.  Individuals
who make proposals should be ready to have their ideas incorporated into a
giant meta-idea that is made by synthesizing EVERYONE's ideas, not just one
person's...unless there is natural and automatic support for that one
idea.  You know what's harder than having an idea? Working out an idea that
everyone agrees to. You know what would create the sense of community
support you are seeking? Working out an idea that everyone agrees to.

This particular idea is actually, to my mind, counterproductive, because it
creates a false sense of permanent solution to a problem that is in fact
perennial.  Also, it creates guidelines that we are committing to
selectively follow. Like the sit/lie law. Which is lame.

Also the occupy website team meets at noisebridge, and anyone who doesn't
like it can go suck an egg.

Love you jake!

<3
R.

mediumreality.com
On Feb 14, 2012 1:10 PM, "Jake" <jake at spaz.org> wrote:

> I look forward to hearing your suggestions on ways of dealing with the
> problems.
>
> I still think my idea is great but i am disappointed that more people
> don't understand how it works.  If people belong at noisebridge they will
> not be at all discouraged by our policy of No Occupy Allowed.
>
> What's the first rule of fight club?  Same thing with occupy.  If you meet
> buddha on the road, kill him.  If someone comes to noisebridge and says
> they're "from occupy" kill them.  If they are there to hack, instead of
> killing them you can encourage them to drop the "occupy" tagline because we
> have trauma associated with that.
>
> You said yourself that we need to meet these challenges with hackerlike
> creativity.  I think that if everyone who is being a dick is also
> identifying as being "from occupy" then a simple solution is to "ban
> occupy".
>
> and that is step one toward uniting out community to back each other up
> onto a mutually-agreed concept.
>
> -jake
>
>  Jake, I think this suggestion stinks. I am surprised you even made it.
>> That
>> guy was being a jerk, which is already not allowed. Why attempt to bar a
>> highly relevant political movement, which you support, instead of just
>> telling dicks to stop being dicks?
>>
>> I think a lot of what people are seeking in these various conflict
>> situations, is a sense of the community backing you up.
>>
>> Dude.
>>
>> It backs you up when someone is being lousy, regardless of whether they
>> come
>> from Free School or Occupy or whatever scruffy group of people find us
>> next.  Banning Free School wouldn't have saved us from Occupy, and banning
>> Occupy wouldn't save us from assholes. It would save us from helping save
>> the world from capitalism.  If it helps we can set up a page on the Occupy
>> website about noisebridge, and not being lame. Then if you need backup
>> against dicks from occupy, you can show them a page on their own website
>> saying not to be dicks.
>>
>> R.
>>
>> mediumreality.com
>>
>> On Feb 13, 2012 4:20 PM, "Kelly" <hurtstotouchfire at gmail.com> wrote:
>>      I think that occupiers who want to hack things should check in
>>      with
>>      the Hackupy group: https://www.noisebridge.net/**wiki/Hackupy<https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Hackupy>who
>>      seem
>>      to have the potential to do occupy work excellently. Do we have
>>      a
>>      contact person for that contingent?
>>
>>      -Kelly
>>
>>      On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 16:17, Matt Joyce <matt at nycresistor.com>
>>      wrote:
>>      > If you ban occupiers don't they just camp wherever you banned
>>      them from?
>>      >
>>      > On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 4:05 PM, Jake <jake at spaz.org> wrote:
>>      >> There have been a few over-the-top assholes staking their
>>      claim to be at
>>      >> noisebridge lately, who are saying that they are welcome
>>      because they are
>>      >> "occupy"
>>      >>
>>      >> I propose that we ban Occupy from noisebridge.  That way,
>>      assholes who use
>>      >> physical intimidation against people questioning why they're
>>      at
>>      >> Noisebridge will have one less "reason" besides puffing
>>      themselves up like
>>      >> a rooster.
>>      >>
>>      >> Please don't troll in response to this post.  Yes I do
>>      understand that we
>>      >> have met many excellent hackers through occupy, but those
>>      people are smart
>>      >> enough to wink when asked if we should "ban occupy" from
>>      noisebridge.
>>      >>
>>      >> Do you have a story to share about an asshole claiming to be
>>      from "occupy"
>>      >> who is trying to occupy noisebridge in a bad way?
>>      >>
>>      >> -jake
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>>
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