[Noisebridge-discuss] Potential misuse of the ultimate power, deleting the 85 page

jim jim at well.com
Wed Mar 7 19:08:55 UTC 2012


    and I'm getting disturbed by some behaviors that seem 
associated with some soceng and policy wonks members (or 
their running dogs). 
    I see those groups as a mixed bag: coming together to 
identify and solve problems is good; succumbing to a 
bonding-driven sense of authority and mission leads to 
inconsiderate behavior, mainly overly hasty actions that 
affect others' interests. 
    Do-ocracy or consensus? I like policy, and maybe 
policy wonks can think out a policy that puts reins on 
destructive actions (which are necessary and good--
getting a bunch of crap out of the space is definitely 
good, but.... 
    The recent jettison of stuff from Turing was too hasty: 
Tom gave notice, kept his word, and moved stuff out the 
very day he said he would. But..., as I heard things, 
robert checked with a few people if it was all junk, got 
assent, and called ewaste, which came and took stuff away 
within a day. The problem? Some of us thought removal to 
ewaste meant there would be some time for us to be able 
to go through it to retrieve what was important to us 
(I think that idea was explicitly mentioned, but I'm too 
lazy to go check). 
    It seems to me that two weeks notice is reasonable to 
move stuff, but another two weeks notice seems reasonable 
before eliminating the stuff altogether. A parallel notion 
is the trash that computer systems implement: you throw it 
away on schedule into the trash, where it sits for a while 
so's you can gasp and go back and get it out before it's 
    No one person can decide everything for everybody and 
get much right, no matter how long or how much they've 
been in and helping with the space. Getting off on doing 
good things seems to obscure the idea that the community 
has to have time to review, and a month seems like 
reasonable propagation time. Hence my suggestion to policy 
wonks to suggest that destructive actions need a month's 
notice or some such. 

On Wed, 2012-03-07 at 01:27 -0800, Rubin Abdi wrote:
> So multiple times it's been asked if a "shit talking" list can be
> created to corner out colorful discussion that would cast others
> participating within the space in negative light. Each time the general
> murmur has been a strong no, pointing out that other spaces have done
> such a thing and it's ended in more shit talking and general social
> violence. If it's a problem within the space it's a problem that's part
> of the community, if it's a community problem (as much as it can get
> dramatic) it should be openly discussed here, hiding it just fosters
> more hate and back channel scheming.
> Currently there's a page on the wiki titled 85 that from my observations
> is turning into a general shit talking about others discussion board.
> https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/85
> I understand it started out as a list for non-excellent people, but it's
> so not that anymore. A wiki really isn't the best of place for a
> discussion like this to occur as it really doesn't allow for everyone
> else to actively take note in the ugly going-ons in the space.
> Additionally folks that are using this page have been hitting some
> pretty nasty edit wars trying to rewrite history to drive a point or in
> defense.
> Here's a funny example that happened while I was writing this...
> https://www.noisebridge.net/index.php?title=85&diff=24373&oldid=24354
> https://www.noisebridge.net/index.php?title=85&diff=24374&oldid=24373
> Anyhow, as much as I'm that asshole who says he's staying pretty hands
> free here with the space, shit like this is dumb and I would like to see
> it stopped. Discussions about these individuals, as much as it's
> annoying, should happen on the discussion list. If a generalized list of
> opinion labeled unfavorables needs to exist, simply write the person's
> name on that page then link to the posts on the mailing list archives
> where you discuss why this person is being anything but excellent. If
> people bitch about not wanting to see that crap on the list, attach the
> [Drama] tag to the subject header.
> And yes I'm more than happy to abuse my wiki admin powers here.
> Thanks for reading.
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