[Noisebridge-discuss] Who do we want to exclude? [Drama]

Sat Apr 13 08:55:00 UTC 2013

*To the Hackers Who Lament Noisebridge Turning into an Art Space*
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*this post color coded for your convenience!*
humor/sarcasm/satire
disarming sincerity
regular
link

Re: "Whom do we want to exclude?"

Artists. We should definitely exclude the artists. We've been letting them
in lately, & look how much the space has already gone downhill.

I assure you that we San Francisco writers, all of us, meet monthly at an
undisclosed location to bitch & groan about those incorrigible artists
(particularly the painters). And I assure you the painters do exactly the
same in reverse. How do I know this? I have the unfortunate fate of being
both: a writer afflicted with artistic tendencies. Since hanging out with
hackers, I've even begun to pick up a juvenile coding habit. Hopefully I'll
be able to arrest this condition before it develops into something truly
embarrassing.

Bear with me, I'm not trying to hijack or crash the thread, though I am
going to attempt to take it in a different direction. I've heard more than
once "senior hacker" complain about the (real or imagined) transformation
of Noisebridge into an art space. I have a problem with this, no doubt
stemming from the fact that 1) I am something of a Noisebridge power user
and 2) I come from an "arts & letters" background rather than a programming
one. I would like to challenge the programmers who are of this opinion to
state their position & the nature of their complaint. I will make the first
move by asking, do you of the programming persuasion not consider writing
code to be an art form?

Donald Knuth does.<http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/62/ArtOfComputerProgramming.jpg/200px-ArtOfComputerProgramming.jpg>

Also, I hear the fundraiser was a success. Although I know things like this
can be like a game of "telephone," the report reaching my ears is that
$5,000 or more was raised. (I have admittedly not attended any meetings
since the fundraiser, nor do I ever attend the general meetings, since I am
a fanatic opera-goer & have a box reserved—lorgnette glasses & all—every
Tuesday night.) While the art auction may have directly generated very
little revenue for the space, the fundraiser itself was originally the
inspiration of several of a trio of artists in the space. Despite not being
present the day of the fundraiser itself, I paid close attention to &
documented the way this event grew, as I am one of the triad who "seeded"
the idea partly with the intention of observing the growth of a social
phenomenon.

Something to chew on. Respond with outrage, ignore, &c as you will; I will
be happy to reply in kind.

Personally, I do not want Noisebridge to become a social services center or
shelter, & have fought against that from the beginning despite my own
status as a semi-houseless, poverty-blessed nomad. On the other hand, I
think Noisebridge makes/would make a beautiful art space: I have this dream
of artists & coders coexisting peaceably side by side, which on certain
days recently looks close to becoming a reality.

+11+

On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 11:19 PM, Danny O'Brien <danny at spesh.com> wrote:

> So, it's explicitly forbidden for us in the lease to go up on the roof. We
> have an explicit carefully negotiated exemption for fitting aerials, but
> email rack before even thinking about doing that.
>
> Here is our lease, for later endless discussion and Internet lawyering.
>
> https://www.noisebridge.net/images/e/ef/2169_Mission_signed_lease-cleaned.pdf
>
> Don't smoke on the fire escape because the smoke gets back in the space,
> it drops ashes on our downstairs neighbours' oranges, and it makes our
> other neighbours' child ill. They've both explicitly asked us not to smoke
> up there, and we try very hard to be excellent to our neighbours. Please
> smoke downstairs and away from the door of the space.
>
> Please explain to people smoking next to the giant "Please no smoking!"
> signs, in a pleasant, carefree manner, exactly why it is not nice to do
> that, and ask them to go downstairs and smoke. Please ask them to tell
> their friends why they should not smoke. A child's asthma is often more
> convincing to strangers than interpretations of the San Francisco Fire Code.
>
> These are good enough reasons, I hope.
>
> d.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
>
> On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 10:57 PM, Sai <noisebridge at saizai.com> wrote:
>
>> FWIW, I remember from when we moved in that our landlord did ask us to
>> not hang out on the roof (vs being there to install something or the like).
>>
>> - sai
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 10:54 PM, Ken M. Haggerty <kenmhaggerty at gmail.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> Again, you won't get in trouble unless:
>>> [_] It is against the landlord's policy and the landlord sees you or
>>> learns otherwise
>>> [_] It is against Noisebridge policy (I don't think it is?) and someone
>>> else asks you to come back in.
>>>
>>> I would guess that it would be similar to standing on a roof or other
>>> non-intentional space. There is no law against standing on your roof
>>> (otherwise you wouldn't be able to clean your roof and gutters) but if you
>>> live in a shared building most landlords will forbid it. I would guess that
>>> the same applies to fire escapes; e.g., my lease forbids me from standing
>>> on the fire escape other than to escape fires. In terms of the law,
>>> you would only become an obstruction if you become immobilized and/or block
>>> the exit.
>>>
>>> I am not familiar with Noisebridge's lease.
>>>
>>> -Ken
>>>
>>> On Friday, April 12, 2013, Curtis Gagliardi wrote:
>>>
>>>> "If you're flammable and have legs you're never blocking a fire exit" -
>>>> Mitch Hedberg (Mitch Hedberg - Fire Exit<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDrzCaC8qzc>
>>>> ).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I'm with Josh in not wanting to smell smoke from the fire exit, but I
>>>> like going out there occasionally for a few minutes.  I don't particularly
>>>> care if I'm violating the fire code or not.  Should I? If someone gets in
>>>> trouble for it, is it on the individual or is it on Noisebridge?  Either
>>>> way, what's the penalty in the rare case that something comes of it?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 11:50 PM, Mitchel McAllister <
>>>> xonimmortal at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Okay, so far, in answer to the question posed autocratically in the
>>>>> original poster's message and the subject line, we have the following:
>>>>>
>>>>> maestro wants the police, anybody who looks like police, and anyone
>>>>> who talks to police excluded
>>>>>
>>>>> Andrew wants anyone using a dictionary or other sources excluded, and
>>>>> also wants his time back.
>>>>>
>>>>> Aly wants... what?  Not sure. I think it has to do with how the police
>>>>> are secretly writing fire codes and building codes.
>>>>>
>>>>> If anybody wants to sit down and rationally discuss ways we can
>>>>> encourage more excellent behavior and stop enabling bad behavior, I am in
>>>>> Turing.
>>>>>
>>>>> If you want to whine and complain, I'm on the fire escape.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> - Reverend Mik McAllister
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>> "You can see the summit but you can't reach it
>>>>> Its the last piece of the puzzle but you just can't make it fit
>>>>> Doctor says you're cured but you still feel the pain
>>>>> Aspirations in the clouds but your hopes go down the drain"
>>>>>  - Howard Jones, "No One Is To Blame"
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>> Purveyor of Subversive Fiction
>>>>> http://www.prismandink.com
>>>>> http://www.lunatextpublications.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>>>>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>>>>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
>>
>
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