[Noisebridge-discuss] anti-anonymity proposals
rachel at xtreme.com
Sun Nov 17 01:33:04 UTC 2013
Jim, you are wrong. Others have explained why in awesome ways so I
won't restate how; I will just note, they are right and you are wrong.
I really hope you think hard about what they've said and not dismiss it
because you are older and have more Life Experience - your Life
Experience does not include anything like what women at NB have
experienced and is, in this case, effectively nil.
On 11/15/13 8:24 PM, jim wrote:
> JS: my replies interspersed below
> On Fri, 2013-11-15 at 14:29 -0800, Snail wrote:
>> On Fri, Nov 15, 2013 at 11:13 AM, jim <jim at systemateka.com> wrote:
>> As to females being harassed, for cases of
>> crude coppings of feels, I dislike taht female
>> turning to the community for support; I would
>> eagerly defend any female who hauled off and
>> slugged whoever copped a feel or to go get some
>> friends and return to verbally educate the
>> offender: it's dis-empowering to perceive one's
>> self as a victim and turn to a community for
>> support for what is an individual incident.
>> Whoa - whoa whoa whoa - whoaaaaa...
>> Time out - did you really just say that women who get groped ("cases
>> of crude coppings of feels") should not ask the community to help them
>> out? And you believe that it's disempowering somehow??
> JS: You've got it correctly. That is my belief. To
> run to a community (in the formal sense) is weakening.
> To run to other people who are supportive is good
> and strengthening. I.e., having a No Harassment
> policy is toxic.
>> And that people should just punch people or deal with it on their own?
>> Is this really what you're suggesting?
> JS: No, my meaning is that I will eagerly defend (support)
> anyone (for the example, female) who slugged another who
> had behaved egregiously and physically.
>> There will be no way fully to suppress such
>> actions taken by horney and inconsiderate
>> personages, policies and rules and committee
>> resolutions aside (far, far aside, I hope).
>> I can't even. Here's a good way to suppress the actions of "horney" or
>> inconsiderate people: never let them back in Noisebridge because
>> that's a terrible excuse for their actions!
> JS: I probably don't agree, but it's a case-by-case
> issue. It seems best to educate and accept and invite,
> as a general rule. Certainly there are some who are
> too disruptive to have around, but case by case....
>> Please ask yourself if you are prone to
>> express yourself when you believe you have the
>> "high ground" and can properly scold others. I.e.,
>> are you living too much with anger?
>> With the rage of a thousand burning stars.
>> TO EVERYONE ELSE READING THIS - There are lots of people in the
>> community at large who will help you out if someone is creeping on you
>> or worse, whether you are "taht females" or just a plain ol' human
> Exactly right!
>> Don't let what Jim says dissuade you from reporting harassment or
>> assault or pointing out creepers!
> "Reporting" sucks and is toxic. Deal with it yourself,
> you and others who support you, but not the community
> as the term is used--do not bring a single incident up
> at meetings or report it to some harassment nazis; do
> ask others for help and do confront the inconsiderate
> one, regardless of the particular action.
>> This is not an opinion everyone here carries.
>> Please don't ever feel like it's your fault or that you're required to
>> punch people -
> no one recommended punching, you'll note. I will
> gladly defend those who defend themselves.
>> it's a valid and rational response to remove yourself from a dangerous
>> situation and try to sort things out later from a safe place rather
>> than confront your harasser/assaulter.
>> If someone is creeping on you, they are pretty much always creeping on
>> OTHERS, too,
> The above is presumptive and not necessarily true.
>> so you are not alone or stuck in some isolated personal incident! And
>> as a community we can try to make Noisebridge a safer place for
> absolutely right!
>> Also, women really appreciate being called women and not "females". Do
>> you go around saying "the males" when referring to men? Probably not.
> My first preferences are "boys" and "girls", then "guys"
> and "gals" and "males" and "females". I dislike the terms
> "men" and "women" because I think those terms bring along
> a lot of toxic baggage.
>> Angry forever,
> too bad; try to change that so you don't grow up to be bitter.
>> ............. _ at y
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