[Noisebridge-discuss] Having a discussion about the kitchen

Fri Apr 4 00:08:47 UTC 2014

Thanks for trolling the list with that nsfw image.  Moderators can we
moderate that user?
On Apr 3, 2014 5:00 PM, "Naomi Most" <pnaomi at gmail.com> wrote:

> Pretty sure the dishwasher either broke or was never properly set up
> to begin with.  It was only in the space for maybe 3 months after we
> opened at 2169.
>
> --Naomi
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 4:35 PM, Ceren Ercen <ceren at ercen.com> wrote:
> > A dishwasher will not change the behavior of people who leave kitchen
> > garbage and dirty plates out. Anyone who has ever had a roommate, ever,
> > knows that. And hell, usually, I'm "that" roommate!
> >
> > On Apr 3, 2014 7:33 PM, "daravinne" <daravinne at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> so uh
> >>
> >>
> >>
> http://www.amazon.com/InterDesign-Clean-Dirty-Dishwasher-Indicator/dp/B00004XSF9/
> >>
> >> in the same vein, a reminder sign reminding people to scrape their
> dishes
> >> before putting them in the dishwasher.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 4:21 PM, Jeffrey Carl Faden <
> jeffreyatw at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Agreed. And there's the even simpler problem of not having a single,
> >>> easy-to-follow system to determine whether the contents are clean or
> not.
> >>> Still interested in hearing how the first one went away. This is
> obviously
> >>> out of date:
> >>> https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Dishwasher
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 4:13 PM, Norman Bradley <pryankster at gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> The problem I see with a dishwasher is that if people "don't know how
> to
> >>>> wash a disk" then they will most likely won't scrape off the dishes
> before
> >>>> putting in the washer. Repeatedly fixing a plugged up washer can get
> quite
> >>>> expensive.
> >>>>
> >>>> You are entitled to your own opinion.
> >>>> You are NOT entitled to your own facts.
> >>>>
> >>>> Norman
> >>>>
> >>>> On 4/3/2014 3:28 PM, daravinne wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> i said it on the other thread and i will say it again.
> >>>>
> >>>> DISHWASHER
> >>>>
> >>>> every company i've worked at has a dishwasher.  i hate washing dishes,
> >>>> myself.  i don't want to waste time away from projects to do boring
> manual
> >>>> labor like washing dishes.  and look! we have the technology to make
> dishes
> >>>> be washed themselves!
> >>>>
> >>>> I am willing to throw money at obtaining a dishwasher for the space.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 1:01 PM, Naomi Gmail <pnaomi at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Btw, point of information:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> sudo room has a dishwasher.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --Naomi
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> > On Apr 3, 2014, at 12:29 PM, Naomi Most <pnaomi at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>> >
> >>>>> > I have no problem believing that some people don't know how to get
> >>>>> > dishes clean.  I have seen that happen many times in my various
> >>>>> > shared
> >>>>> > living situations.
> >>>>> >
> >>>>> > Asserting that people "should not" do a thing if they are ignorant
> of
> >>>>> > something is basically a nonstarter.  I don't know how to read
> what's
> >>>>> > available in people's brains as they take a glass from the shelf
> and
> >>>>> > pour a drink.  Do you?
> >>>>> >
> >>>>> > --Naomi
> >>>>> >
> >>>>> >
> >>>>> >> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 12:02 PM, Hannah Grimm <
> dharlette at gmail.com>
> >>>>> >> wrote:
> >>>>> >> "2) There is no clear understanding of how to properly use the
> >>>>> >> kitchen. The
> >>>>> >> average person in the kitchen does not understand how to wash a
> dish
> >>>>> >> and has
> >>>>> >> an opportunity to be taught. Once again a couple people are
> >>>>> >> mobilized to
> >>>>> >> micromanage the kitchen, but there is no greater community
> >>>>> >> understanding."
> >>>>> >>
> >>>>> >> Excuse me, what?  Dishwashing is a very simple thing.  We should
> not
> >>>>> >> have to
> >>>>> >> teach people how to wash the dishes.  If you do not know how to
> wash
> >>>>> >> your
> >>>>> >> own dishes, then you should not be using a community kitchen.
> >>>>> >>
> >>>>> >>
> >>>>> >>> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 9:52 AM, Praveen Sinha <dmhomee at gmail.com
> >
> >>>>> >>> wrote:
> >>>>> >>>
> >>>>> >>> THIS IS WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT HELL YEAH COMMUNITY BUILDING
> >>>>> >>>
> >>>>> >>> Thanks so much James and Dana, these conversations and
> >>>>> >>> understanding and
> >>>>> >>> getting past preconceptions of each other and reporting back is
> >>>>> >>> really
> >>>>> >>> really important foundational work.  Big plus!!!
> >>>>> >>>
> >>>>> >>>
> >>>>> >>> On Thu, Apr 3, 2014 at 8:05 AM, James Sundquist
> >>>>> >>> <sundquistjames at gmail.com>
> >>>>> >>> wrote:
> >>>>> >>>>
> >>>>> >>>> Last night there was a lengthy discussion about communal usage
> of
> >>>>> >>>> the
> >>>>> >>>> kitchen that spontaneously lasted from 9 - 11:30.  Coffee and
> cake
> >>>>> >>>> were
> >>>>> >>>> served.  We talked about do-ocracy, responsibility, and how to
> >>>>> >>>> have
> >>>>> >>>> effective communication about the kitchen.
> >>>>> >>>>
> >>>>> >>>> A big take away was that people need to talk about this
> in-person
> >>>>> >>>> and
> >>>>> >>>> consider how it impacts everyone, because removing the kitchen
> >>>>> >>>> will not
> >>>>> >>>> remove Noisebridge's problems by itself.  I just want to note
> that
> >>>>> >>>> this
> >>>>> >>>> really was a discussion, which included everyone being able to
> >>>>> >>>> speak their
> >>>>> >>>> mind while being respected; the point of talking was to gain
> >>>>> >>>> perspective by
> >>>>> >>>> asking questions rather than talking over others.
> >>>>> >>>>
> >>>>> >>>> 1) A big reason the daily users of the kitchen do not respect
> you
> >>>>> >>>> is
> >>>>> >>>> because they do not know you or feel any connection in the space
> >>>>> >>>> without a
> >>>>> >>>> communal kitchen.  Any valid concerns of those who want to
> disable
> >>>>> >>>> are
> >>>>> >>>> unknown to the daily users of the kitchen.
> >>>>> >>>>
> >>>>> >>>> 2) There is no clear understanding of how to properly use the
> >>>>> >>>> kitchen.
> >>>>> >>>> The average person in the kitchen does not understand how to
> wash
> >>>>> >>>> a dish and
> >>>>> >>>> has an opportunity to be taught. Once again a couple people are
> >>>>> >>>> mobilized to
> >>>>> >>>> micromanage the kitchen, but there is no greater community
> >>>>> >>>> understanding.
> >>>>> >>>>
> >>>>> >>>> 3) It is difficult to know how capable we all are of having a
> >>>>> >>>> respectful
> >>>>> >>>> conversation to allows people to maintain their dignity, because
> >>>>> >>>> community
> >>>>> >>>> building should be the goal when people are in conflict.
> >>>>> >>>>
> >>>>> >>>> 4) A big part of this as I understood it was reassessing how
> >>>>> >>>> people are
> >>>>> >>>> introduced to this space.  Example, "Welcome to Noisebridge;
> we're
> >>>>> >>>> a 501c3
> >>>>> >>>> Non-profit that encourages education and learning by doing.
>  This
> >>>>> >>>> is a
> >>>>> >>>> Do-It-Yourself space so at a base minimum you're expected to
> wash
> >>>>> >>>> your own
> >>>>> >>>> dishes and keep your work area clean for the next person."
> >>>>> >>>>
> >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> >>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >>>>> >>>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >>>>> >>>>
> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >>>>> >>>
> >>>>> >>>
> >>>>> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> >>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >>>>> >>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >>>>> >>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >>>>> >>
> >>>>> >>
> >>>>> >> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> >> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >>>>> >> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >>>>> >> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >>>>> >
> >>>>> >
> >>>>> >
> >>>>> > --
> >>>>> > Naomi Theora Most
> >>>>> > naomi at nthmost.com
> >>>>> > +1-415-728-7490
> >>>>> >
> >>>>> > skype: nthmost
> >>>>> >
> >>>>> > http://twitter.com/nthmost
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >>>>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >>>>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >>>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >>>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >>>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >>>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> > Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Naomi Theora Most
> naomi at nthmost.com
> +1-415-728-7490
>
> skype: nthmost
>
> http://twitter.com/nthmost
> _______________________________________________
> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>
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