[Noisebridge-discuss] Fwd: how Noisebridge could improve

Lupita Berries garyberries at gmail.com
Thu Apr 17 19:12:13 UTC 2014

I second this point. People who are overly protective of 'respecting' the
privacy of creeps, are making the statement that creeps need protecting and
priority over past/future vicitims/targets who have maintained good
behavior in this space. If people are really serious about creating a
welcoming environment at NB, we shouldn't be scared of using names.

On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 10:35 AM, rachel lyra hospodar
<rachelyra at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hey all,
> I notice that in this thread a Very Creepy Person is mentioned over and
> over but not by name.
> I understand and respect the desire not to needlessly drag someone's name
> around on a publicly archived list but I do think it's important, if
> someone is banned, that we publicly name them, in order to maintain the ban.
> One feature of an organic system is that its components must be reinforced
> or they fade away. Do we have a rogues' gallery of predatory offenders? Is
> it maintained every time a new ban put is in place? This, as a wiki page,
> sounds like an administrative overhead that would not be consistently
> fulfilled, tbh. In general I think that this rogues gallery is maintained
> in the public consciousness, where we all remember that there are
> creepazoids, and if someone is creepy we mentally reference them against
> past creepazoids before declaring "hey Rob2.0 is back and sleeping on the
> roof again" or else "hey a new creepy stranger is using the roof for a date
> spot".  when we talk about things I would prefer if we used a name or if
> preferred handle so that we can maintain the database in our heads. These
> stories are of value to me when there is a way for them to be related to
> the perpetrator. Otherwise it's just like the feces I cleaned from the sink
> that time, or the dental dam I found in the bathroom during a party... just
> another piece of icky trash clogging up the tubes, not helping anyone with
> anything, not even disposed of properly.
> Creepy felons shouldn't get name protection at the expense of our Creep
> Defense System's being able to identify them. The bay area tech scene is
> quite small, and someone who is banned from Noisebridge is still likely to
> be encountered by those of our denizens who manage to live here and also
> leave their house.
> R.
>  On Apr 11, 2014 9:36 PM, "Hannah Grimm" <dharlette at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hey, remember that time when there was that guy who liked to hang out at
>> NB 24/7, give tours, moderate meetings, & redshirt, but then it turned out
>> he was a sexual predator with a history of battering women who was living
>> at Noisebridge to evade the regulations about how far from a school
>> registered sex offenders are allowed to live?
>> On Fri, Apr 11, 2014 at 3:36 PM, Christoph Maier <
>> christoph.maier at ieee.org> wrote:
>>> As much as I find that it complicates matters,
>>> you can devise rules, mission statemens [see
>>> https://noisebridge.net/wiki/File:Noisebridge_Mission_Statement.JPG for
>>> my stab at it],
>>> visions, etc. etc.
>>> all you want, but in the end, whether stuff works or doesn't depends on
>>> specific people and their idiosyncratic way of making stuff work.
>>> And those people change from time to time ... anything long-term at
>>> noisebridge is beyond my imagination.
>>> I can think of a bazillion reasons why what works with Frantisek doesn't
>>> work with anyone else.
>>> The alternative is that Law Enforcement (i.e. folks who like to enforce
>>> laws on others), or chaos.
>>> Well, some folks make Chaos AND things work :-P
>>> On Fri, Apr 11, 2014 at 2:17 PM, Naomi Most <pnaomi at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> That's a romantic idea, but in practicality it's a fragile arrangement.
>>>> Whatever you think of having people live in the space (for, against,
>>>> "it's complicated"), whether we are zoned for live-work or not, I'm
>>>> sure anyone reading this can think of a dozen different reasons why
>>>> reliance on a single person's motivations is not a long-term solution
>>>> for anything at Noisebridge.
>>>> Not that you were suggesting so, Christoph.  I am just taking the
>>>> opportunity to make the point.
>>>> On Fri, Apr 11, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Christoph Maier
>>>> <christoph.maier at ieee.org> wrote:
>>>> > After running into Frantisek at Seoul Hackerspace, I imagine how
>>>> Frantisek,
>>>> > as trusted squatter-in-residence, would improve both friendliness and
>>>> > security of a hackerspace. But some <expletive deleted> tore out half
>>>> the
>>>> > kitchen.
>>>> >
>>>> > On Apr 11, 2014 7:58 AM, "Naomi Most" <pnaomi at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Addendum:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Our lack of security can also be chalked up to a failure of
>>>> imagination.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Oh, I know we've imagined things, but largely they have been along
>>>> the
>>>> >> lines of doing one or two individual things, which really could not
>>>> >> work on their own because of the limitedness of their scope and/or
>>>> the
>>>> >> unfeasibility of the resources (e.g. humans) needed to perpetuate
>>>> >> them.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> We have never totally imagined the security of the space as a system.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Please don't take me to mean that security is hopeless.  I mean
>>>> mostly
>>>> >> to say that at Noisebridge it is Very Hard.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Larger post coming soon.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> --Naomi
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