[Noisebridge-discuss] reasoning about the kitchen

Tue Apr 15 21:06:41 UTC 2014

Seems like the sign would be quickly taken down, but it would be an
interesting experiment. Maybe make it more interesting by placing a
checklist on it and making sure that someone signs off on the kitchen's
cleanliness every day. If it goes neglected, it speaks for itself.

On Tue, Apr 15, 2014 at 2:01 PM, Hannah Grimm <dharlette at gmail.com> wrote:

> How about we just post a sign in the kitchen that says that if the kitchen
> is not kept clean it will be torn down?
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 15, 2014 at 1:55 PM, Naomi Most <pnaomi at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Who is shouting and/or posturing?
>>
>> You're right, Cynthia and several others who are important in this
>> discussion are not on the mailing list.
>>
>> That is an identified problem.  Do you have any suggestions for
>> keeping asynchronous discussions going with people who are not on the
>> mailing list, won't sign up for Slack, and won't use IRC?
>>
>> I'm all ears and eyes.  I do not want to leave people out of
>> discussions, but I cannot fathom how Noisebridge can progress as an
>> organization in an environment of requiring people to be on-site at
>> the same physical space and time.
>>
>> --Naomi
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 15, 2014 at 4:50 PM, Norman Bradley <pryankster at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > With all of the shouting and posturing there is a person that is not
>> here on
>> > the list. Cynthia washes dishes and on occasion helps cook stuff.
>> >
>> > When I showed up on Monday she was washing dishes and cleaning up the
>> place.
>> >
>> > Oh also using one of our public computers close by the kitchen.
>> >
>> > I don't think she is on this or another list.
>> >
>> > You are entitled to your own opinion.
>> > You are NOT entitled to your own facts.
>> >
>> > Norman
>> >
>> >
>> > On 4/14/2014 3:07 PM, Naomi Most wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Here is how I came to the conclusion that we should issue an ultimatum
>> >> for cleaning up the kichen.
>> >>
>> >> (I don't care how we got to the situation we're in, and none of the
>> >> following should be read as implying blame.)
>> >>
>> >> Read each point as a statement of fact, but please debate me on
>> >> individual points if they seem incorrect.
>> >>
>> >> 1. Noisebridge's core mission has nothing whatsoever to do with the
>> >> presence of a kitchen.
>> >>
>> >> 2. The kitchen has been stochastically maintained whilst being nearly
>> >> constantly used.
>> >>
>> >> 3. The usage of the kitchen has been largely by those who don't
>> >> understand the health hazards of misusing a shared community kitchen.
>> >>
>> >> (again: please don't read blame into these statements. it doesn't
>> >> matter "who", it only matters "what".)
>> >>
>> >> 4. Because of (2) and (3), the kitchen has become a health hazard.
>> >> (Many health hazards: mold, vermin, cross-contamination, etc)
>> >>
>> >> 5. There are many people who love having a kitchen.
>> >>
>> >> 6. There are many people who dislike or don't care about having a
>> kitchen.
>> >>
>> >> 7. Those belonging to (6) mostly want to see the kitchen removed.
>> >>
>> >> 8. Those belonging to (5) mostly want to keep the kitchen.
>> >>
>> >> 9. Health hazards are Bad.  Like, "harassment" Bad.  Like, someone
>> >> could get a bad disease Bad.
>> >>
>> >> ERGO, in the spirit of do-ocracy:
>> >>
>> >> 10. Those belonging to (5) ought to be putting work into making the
>> >> kitchen NOT a health hazard.  The onus falls on the group who uses the
>> >> space to do something about it.
>> >>
>> >> 11. Those belonging to (5) have thus far not shown initiative in
>> >> protecting the resource.
>> >>
>> >> ERGO, in the spirit of do-ocracy:
>> >>
>> >> 12. Those belonging to (6) ought to incentivize those belonging to (5)
>> >> to hurry up and do something about it.
>> >>
>> >> OK, does that make sense?
>> >>
>> >> This isn't about any authority trying to step in and "punish" people.
>> >>
>> >> This is about making it clear that if people want a thing to exist at
>> >> Noisebridge -- particular one that is fairly peripheral to what
>> >> Noisebridge is about -- they should take care of it.
>> >>
>> >> I have suggested that this group form a "kitchen working group" to
>> sort it
>> >> out.
>> >>
>> >> If it can't be sorted out, I don't think it's unreasonable for those
>> >> who don't care about having a kitchen but are worried about the health
>> >> hazards of the kitchen to do-ocratically dismantle it.
>> >>
>> >> Thanks for reading.
>> >>
>> >> --Naomi
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>> > Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>> > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Naomi Theora Most
>> naomi at nthmost.com
>> +1-415-728-7490
>>
>> skype: nthmost
>>
>> http://twitter.com/nthmost
>> _______________________________________________
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>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>>
>
>
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