[Noisebridge-discuss] Sleepers

Gregory Dillon gregorydillon at gmail.com
Tue Jan 28 20:05:40 UTC 2014

Hi List,

Al, let me think about your advice.  I agree that my proposal is accurately
described as vague.   But that it is purposeful vague because that reflects
reality.   In life, there are some concepts that are vague but still
express broad principles.  The community view on sleeping at Noisebridge is
currently vague but I think there are some broad principles of agreement..

I have tried to articulate what I believe is consensable:  that many agree
sleeping at Noisebride is taking up too much energy at meetings, that
sleeping at Noisebridge is harming the space, but that gray areas exist,
that some "sanctioning" event should be triggered by sleeping at
Noisebridge, but the actual "sanction" should depend on the circumstances.

My consensus proposal says that there should be some "sanction" for
sleeping at Noisebridge, but that they should be effected only after
considering the full circumstance, and therefore the range of "sanctions"
should be broad.    Maybe the sanction is only a verbal warning that people
are going to be watching if your are sleeping too often.  Or on the other
end, it looks like your are not hacking but are are setting up residency
there, our lease doesn't allow that and that residency threatens the
existence of Noisebridge, so a strict sanction is appropriate.

Al, I'll consider your advice,  but I would not want  a specific actionable
proposal that would  act as a "sentencing guidelines" based on 30 different
sleeping scenarios.  I want to trust the wisdom of the group to implement
an answer based on the broad principles that sleeping should have some
response from the community, but the sanctions could vary widely.

On Tue, Jan 28, 2014 at 11:05 AM, Al Sweigart <asweigart at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hey Greg, the consensus proposal seems really vague: I'm not sure what the
> actual policy or guidelines it proposes are. Do you want to take that off
> the consensus item list and instead have it as a discussion item at the
> meeting? The consensus proposals are really for actionable and
> clearly-worded policy, but it looks more like you'd like to have a
> conversation on it to determine what the policy should be.
> On Mon, Jan 27, 2014 at 4:39 PM, Gregory Dillon <gregorydillon at gmail.com>wrote:
>> Thank you Monad,
>> I have a consensus proposal<https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Current_Consensus_Items>up for consideration that asks for circumspection and "slack" for people
>> found sleeping when it is due.   It is a purposefully a soft measure that I
>> hope can get support from all ends of the spectrum on this issue.
>> Many members of the community will feel that my proposal does not go far
>> enough to be a  solution on sleeping at Noisebridge, and there may be
>>  laissez fairests who favor unrestrained sleep locations.   But I think
>> that is its strength.   A workable compromise.    I ask you to consider it
>> as a way to address the sleeping issue, while being caring and considerate
>> that people are finding it hard to find a place to lay their head down to
>> sleep.
>> .
>> On Mon, Jan 27, 2014 at 4:17 PM, Paul Monad <immonad at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> The only tool we have at the moment is:  personally wake them, ask if
>>> they are sponsored then ... , or asking them to leave and come to the next
>>> meeting.   Jake pointed out certain individuals should be given slack for a
>>> short time.  Circumspection and discretion is mandatory.
>>> They invariably say they were asleep for a very short time.  If left
>>> alone, is soon back asleep.
>>> As many as possible should speak directly with the problem individuals
>>> because this is a community of doers.  It shouldn't be the efforts of the
>>> few. Perception is important.
>>> Anyone who wants to participate but have transportation problems please
>>> contact me.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>> --
>> Let's stay in touch.  Greg
>> _______________________________________________
>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss

Let's stay in touch.  Greg
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