[Noisebridge-discuss] noisebridge / the door is fucked up

[Al Sweigart]

Charlie, that does not clear anything up, and isn't relevant to the current
discussion.

Maybe you should take a break from the mailing list for a while.


On Thu, Mar 6, 2014 at 3:20 PM, Charles Tang <cjtang1 at asu.edu> wrote:

> Maybe this should clear it up.
>
> Dave Dave! DBSASF.
>
>
> On Thursday, 6 March 2014, Al Sweigart <asweigart at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Kevin: I don't want Noisebridge to become Hacker Dojo or Tech Shop. The
>> bay area already has a Hacker Dojo and a Tech Shop.
>>
>> I don't require people to be "normal" (however you want to define that
>> word). I don't want Noisebridge to be an monocultural club of white male
>> college-educated twenty-somethings who are unaware of privilege.
>>
>> Haven't you noticed that the only people I have a problem with are the
>> ones who steal things (like Pidgeon) or cuss people out/purposefully break
>> things (like Dan) or monopolize the space to use as their home (like a lot
>> of people in the past)? Even for those folks, I've stopped pushing to have
>> them banned from the space.
>>
>> You're frame this as "Al doesn't like people who are different". That's a
>> convenient narrative if you want to keep the status quo. But we've all seen
>> the culture created by "Just be excellent to each other". It has good
>> parts, but the bad parts are intolerable.
>>
>> -Al
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 6, 2014 at 12:11 PM, <bfb at riseup.net> wrote:
>>
>> > Jake and all,
>> >
>> > I understand your frustration, because it's one I've had too. I think
>> that
>> > there are a few people at Noisebridge who like it being a clubhouse or a
>> > place with free rent (but only for their friends, not the general
>> public,
>> > of course) and use consensus so that they can prevent anyone from
>> changing
>> > this. For all the anarchist rhetoric, Noisebridge is the most
>> conservative
>> > organization I've ever been a part of.
>> >
>> > People sleeping overnight at the space has been a problem FOR YEARS.
>> > People living out of the space and storing their personal things there
>> has
>> > been a problem FOR YEARS.
>> > Being unable to get rid of people who abuse and steal from others or
>> > regularly get stoned/drunk/loud/unexcellent has been a problem FOR
>> YEARS.
>> >
>> > The bylaws of Noisebridge (our Constitution, as it were) state that the
>> > board of directors makes all the executive decisions for the
>> organization.
>> > It's just that the board has deferred to the consensus process in the
>> > past.
>> > I believe this is precisely why these problems are so hard to fix,
>> > including when I served on the board in 2011.
>> >
>> > Members have gotten tired of this, which is why a board that wants to
>> take
>> > a more active hand in stopping these abuses has been voted in.
>> >
>> > Jake, I know we're going to have to start proving ourselves with deeds
>> > instead of just words, but you're a great contributor to the space.
>> Making
>> > Noisebridge more welcoming to hackers like you is exactly what we want
>> to
>> > do in 2014.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Wed, Mar 5, 2014 at 11:29 PM, Adrian Chadd
>> > <adrian.chadd at gmail.com>wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 5 March 2014 23:27, Jake <jake at spaz.org> wrote:
>> >> > not much, i was just stirred to action by the self-congratulatory
>> >> progress
>> >> > of electing a meaningless board while the ship that is noisebridge
>> >> slowly
>> >> > fills with sewage while waiting for a crew.
>> >> >
>> >> > what was i supposed to do, threaten to hold my breath until changes
>> >> are
>> >> > made?
>> >>
>> >> I believe the answer is "grab a plunger" ?
>> >>
>> >> (which you did, right?)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> -a
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>> >> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>> >> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>> >>
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>> > Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>> > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>> >
>>
>> Charles and all,
>>
>> I understand your frustration, because it's one I've had too. I think that
>> there are a few people at Noisebridge who like it being a clubhouse (but
>> only for their "normal" friends, not the general public, of course) or a
>> place to exercise power over others and use policy to maintain this. For
>> all the anarchist rhetoric, Noisebridge is the most conservative, and at
>> times backwards, organizations I've ever been a part of.
>>
>> Thank you Al for providing me a pattern to express my thoughts in a way
>> that maybe you will hear.
>>
>> "Seriously" concerned about trying to create culture with policy,
>> Kevin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>>  <https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss>
>>
>>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.noisebridge.net/pipermail/noisebridge-discuss/attachments/20140306/4b624dcb/attachment-0003.html>