[Noisebridge-discuss] why would hackers come to noisebridge?

Thu Mar 13 16:10:55 UTC 2014

Is there a reason why there's 24 hour access? It seems like you guys can't
staff it appropriately for that.

On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 11:06 AM, Ronald Cotoni <setient at gmail.com> wrote:

> TBQH part of a hacker space is trying new things.  All of the hackerspaces
> on the planet have different sets of issues and deal with them differently.
>  An approach in one place may not work very well elsewhere.  So I submit to
> you this is a different form of hacking.  Policy hacking.  Trying different
> methods until we find the one that fits for us.  I am not sure what is
> happening with Consensus but it would be nice if we had a board that got us
> things. By things, I mean making sure the bathrooms were clean either by
> doocracy or by paying someone to do it.  Making sure the sprinkler system
> works.  Making sure we have fire extinguishers.   Making sure people are
> respecting the space.  Usually this could be done by doocracy but with
> people like you leaving Mark, that is a pipe dream.   And for noisebridge,
> which is 24/7 (sudroom which is not) there are different issues that you
> don't have to deal with.  You may or may not find yourself in the exact
> same situation with a bigger space.   I would strongly suggest reading over
> the past few years of meeting notes and seeing if you see any similarities
> between sudoroom and noisebridge since sudoroom is mildly based on
> noisebridge.
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 8:53 AM, Torrie Fischer <tdfischer at hackerbots.net>wrote:
>
>> On Thursday, March 13, 2014 07:19:04 Marc Juul wrote:
>> > On Wed, Mar 5, 2014 at 3:07 PM, Jake <jake at spaz.org> wrote:
>> > > well, you're doing more to fix the infrastructure than I have lately,
>> but
>> > > that is not the kind of problems i'm talking about.
>> > >
>> > > my complaint is that the culture of noisebridge has become so
>> > > uninteresting
>> > > and unrelated to hacking that it is bordering on irrelavent. The fact
>> that
>> > > you are volunteering your time to maintain the internet at a homeless
>> > > shelter is quaint, but it doesn't change the fact that most hackers
>> don't
>> > > want to go there anymore.
>> > >
>> > > there are two categories of reasons why a hacker would want to go to
>> > > noisebridge:
>> > >
>> > > 1> other hackers are there, and people they can relate to and share
>> > > interesting conversation with, or just be around while working on
>> projects
>> > > of their own.  People are there experimenting on things, hardware
>> software
>> > > and other, and one might learn something or teach something or make
>> new
>> > > friends with similar interests.
>> > >
>> > > 2> there is a "safe space" with technical infrastructure.  This means
>> that
>> > > people who refuse to be HIGHLY accountable for problematic behavior
>> are
>> > > simply not permitted to be present (a much higher standard than we
>> have
>> > > now).  Oh and lets not forget at least one usable bathroom with a
>> decent
>> > > toilet seat and toilet paper.
>> > >
>> > > This also means that the technical infrastructure is in place and
>> usable.
>> > > For software people this means the internet works and there are
>> outlets,
>> > > clean places to sit (with decent posture, not fall-in couches) and
>> tables
>> > > for laptops and room to work with others.
>> > >
>> > > For hardware this means that tools are more than just the bottom of
>> the
>> > > barrel (try finding a pair of scissors or a phillips screwdriver) and
>> that
>> > > there are actually nice things (a soldering iron with a temperature
>> > > control
>> > > instead of $2 china disposable irons), AND more advanced tools are
>> > > available such as microcontroller programmers, blank microcontrollers,
>> > > and other electronic hardware for raw material.
>> > >
>> > > Noisebridge used to have a great collection of microcontrollers and
>> > > programmers and breadboards and jumper wires and advanced electronic
>> > > tools,
>> > > but all of that stuff was REPEATEDLY taken down from the top shelf and
>> > > scattered into the e-waste piles, and then thrown away.  Yes, our
>> > > microcontroller and programmer collection has made its way to the
>> trash.
>> > >
>> > > categories 1 and 2 are related;  if a hackerspace has one without the
>> > > other, hackers still may not decide to go.  Certainly I think both are
>> > > equally important.  I also feel that at this time, and for too long,
>> > > noisebridge has not had either.
>> > >
>> > > P.S. please notice that ONE OF THE THINGS YOU CAN DO TO HELP IS TO GO
>> TO
>> > > NOISEBRIDGE MORE OFTEN.
>> >
>> > Since reading the policy that visitors to noisebridge are required to
>> > have a member vouch for them at all times, I no longer feel welcome at
>> > noisebridge. I know that several others feel the same way.
>> >
>> > I remember Jake's original suggestion related to this. The idea was
>> > that anyone asking a visitor to leave would first have to ask if any
>> > member is willing to vouch for the visitor to stay, and only if no-one
>> > vouches can the non-member be asked to leave. That is reasonable.
>> > Putting the responsibility on the visitor of having a member pre-vouch
>> > for them at all times is both unwelcoming and unreasonable.
>> >
>> > Now, I'm seeing one of the board members implying that the board will
>> > no longer be passive, which I take it to mean that noisebridge is no
>> > longer ruled by consensus.
>>
>> I'm just an associate member of noisebridge on the other side of the US
>> with
>> no real influence, or even a desire to get involved, so here is my $0.02
>> based
>> on my previous position of being an officer of SYNHAK, and our
>> terrifyingly
>> heavy-handed and pre-emptive board that was elected a few weeks ago.
>>
>> I feel that it is possible and somewhat important for the management of a
>> hackerspace to be active while still respecting the wishes of the
>> membership.
>> The board and officers should still be held responsible to the membership
>> by
>> the community. Noisebridge bylaws permit the removal of the board, should
>> it
>> come to that:
>>
>> https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/bylaws#c._Removal_of_Directors
>>
>> It is never a good idea for the board to get to such a point that demands
>> for
>> resignation or removal start showing up (see synhak's discuss@ for many
>> tears), so I imagine that the consensus process would still be respected.
>>
>> SYNHAK is experimenting with a few procedural changes with our governance
>> structure in the next few weeks in an attempt to curb the decision making
>> abilities of the board and officers. First, an amendment to our bylaws
>> that
>> essentially states that the membership runs the space:
>>
>> "The powers not delegated to the Officers of SYNHAK by these Bylaws, nor
>> prohibited to the members through The Board or these Bylaws are reserved
>> to
>> the Membership."
>>
>> Sounds a bit 10th amendment-ish, yeah. It has no real effect on the
>> corporation other than to explicitly state that the membership is in
>> charge.
>> The Board still legally retains absolute power and can do things like set
>> a
>> corporate alcohol and drug policy, approve a new lease, strip membership
>> from
>> individuals, pass a bylaw amendment that nulls this, etc. It does,
>> however,
>> give the membership some control over what the management does.
>>
>> The second component of this is an upcoming modification to our consensus
>> process which is roughly based off of Noisebridge's. It adds three
>> constraints
>> on blocking consensus: One person may block consensus for no longer than 6
>> weeks, an indefinite block can only happen with the support of a total of
>> three members, and the reason for a block must be clearly and explicitly
>> written in the meeting minutes.
>>
>> Nobody is required to approve of the reason for a block, but this
>> prevents a
>> single person from stopping the entire process without having to put the
>> effort in to convince others why their position is valid. While a
>> proposal is
>> under a block, the community is encouraged to figure out the best way to
>> reach
>> consensus on the issue.
>>
>> If you're worried about consensus being steamrolled by the board, perhaps
>> those concerns are best addressed by asking the board to explain how they
>> feel
>> Noisebridge's governance process fits in with their plans. Reaching
>> consensus
>> about respecting consensus, if you will.
>>
>> >
>> > It makes me both sad and angry that noisebridge has become a place
>> > where hackers don't feel welcome.
>> >
>> > If anyone wants to help build a hackerspace similar to what
>> > noisebridge used to be, I invite you all too come join sudo room in
>> > oakland as we prepare to move to a much bigger space (a space very
>> > similar to noisebridge's current space!). We have open meetings every
>> > Wednesday at 7 pm at 22nd and Broadway, located just two blocks from
>> > 19th street BART.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Ronald Cotoni
> Systems Engineer
>
> _______________________________________________
> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>
>

-- 
Jessica R. Ross
jessica.r.ross at gmail.com
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