[Neuro] Neuro Digest, Vol 32, Issue 4
LinkReincarnate
linkreincarnate at gmail.com
Thu May 2 02:54:30 UTC 2013
Oh and I'll be lucky to sell 25 in a year. For reference. I think a years
worth of work is worth at least 500 dollars. Don't you?
On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 7:53 PM, LinkReincarnate
<linkreincarnate at gmail.com>wrote:
> My markup is only 20 dollars per device. For every 25 I source, build,
> test, and sell I get 500 dollars. I'm not exactly becoming
> a millionaire here. My costs to build them is 50. If I were being a
> proper capitalist I would be charging at least 100 because that is double
> my cost. Many people say you can only keep a business afloat if you charge
> 3 times your cost. If you can find an adjustable current,current ramping ,
> assembled and shipped tdcs device for less than 70 please link to it. I
> don't think you can though. Can you build one yourself for cheaper? Of
> course*
> *(ignoring your own labor costs)
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:47 PM, <neuro-request at lists.noisebridge.net>wrote:
>
>> Send Neuro mailing list submissions to
>> neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>>
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/neuro
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>> neuro-request at lists.noisebridge.net
>>
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>> neuro-owner at lists.noisebridge.net
>>
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of Neuro digest..."
>>
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>> 1. Re: Fwd: tDCS at Noisebridge? (John Withers)
>> 2. Re: Neuro Digest, Vol 32, Issue 3 (LinkReincarnate)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Wed, 01 May 2013 16:58:11 -0700
>> From: John Withers <jwithers at reddagger.org>
>> To: neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> Subject: Re: [Neuro] Fwd: tDCS at Noisebridge?
>> Message-ID: <5181AC13.4000800 at reddagger.org>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>>
>> I can't make it tonight or next week, but unless those electrodes are
>> made of solid gold, that's a crazy high markup.
>>
>> If anyone isn't into paying $70 but more like $25, feel free to contact
>> me and I will be happy to show you how to make your own lm334 regulator
>> when I get back into town in a couple of weeks. Hell, I can tell you
>> pretty much everything you need to know over email. This isn't very
>> complicated and uses about $6 in parts and a meter.
>>
>> j
>>
>> On 05/01/2013 04:49 PM, LinkReincarnate wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>> > From: *LinkReincarnate* <linkreincarnate at gmail.com
>> > <mailto:linkreincarnate at gmail.com>>
>> > Date: Wed, May 1, 2013 at 4:44 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [Neuro] tDCS at Noisebridge?
>> > To: Rohan Dixit <rohan at brainbot.me <mailto:rohan at brainbot.me>>
>> > Cc: Chung-Hay Luk <luk at chunghay.com <mailto:luk at chunghay.com>>
>> >
>> >
>> > I'll be at noisebridge in about 30 minutes. Also for anyone else who
>> > is interested in a tdcs device of their own. I just made a bulk order
>> > to build about 25 of them. (only enough electrodes for about 7 kits
>> > though) If I had a class at noisebridge on how to build and use
>> > tdcs devices would people show up and buy the kits? I'd charge 70
>> > dollars a device including nice electrodes (5x7 cm or 5x5 cm
>> > conductive silicon sponge pouch electrodes) We would cover the device
>> > itself, the 10-20 system. Popular montages, and dosage considerations
>> > and anything else that people are interested in.
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Wed, 1 May 2013 17:47:17 -0700
>> From: LinkReincarnate <linkreincarnate at gmail.com>
>> To: neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> Subject: Re: [Neuro] Neuro Digest, Vol 32, Issue 3
>> Message-ID:
>> <CACHQ1TFa33p+TwY06sGcoi6mry=h-+mOsBYt+AtU6gZ8LZ=
>> aCA at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>
>> I am here now and sitting at the electronics bench on the left side as you
>> enter noisebridge
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 4:49 PM, <neuro-request at lists.noisebridge.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Send Neuro mailing list submissions to
>> > neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> >
>> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>> > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/neuro
>> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>> > neuro-request at lists.noisebridge.net
>> >
>> > You can reach the person managing the list at
>> > neuro-owner at lists.noisebridge.net
>> >
>> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> > than "Re: Contents of Neuro digest..."
>> >
>> >
>> > Today's Topics:
>> >
>> > 1. Re: Readings on the brain and dreaming (Sarah Tappon)
>> > 2. Re: Readings on the brain and dreaming (Anthony Di Franco)
>> > 3. Fwd: tDCS at Noisebridge? (LinkReincarnate)
>> >
>> >
>> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 1
>> > Date: Wed, 1 May 2013 09:02:08 -0700
>> > From: Sarah Tappon <sarah.tappon at gmail.com>
>> > To: Jade Solomon <jade.solomon at me.com>
>> > Cc: neuro <neuro at lists.noisebridge.net>
>> > Subject: Re: [Neuro] Readings on the brain and dreaming
>> > Message-ID:
>> > <CA+5ROHkUuuRU2s_D-up39pRyn4ZFVmh3CRuZ=MUa=
>> > UCFXOf8+w at mail.gmail.com>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>> >
>> > NB: The functional significance of "mirror neurons" in human cognition
>> > is controversial and a lot of people disagree with Ramachandran. Here
>> > are some alternate perspectives on the general issue:
>> >
>> >
>> http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/2012/11/06/whats-so-special-about-mirror-neurons/
>> > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2773693/
>> >
>> > (My understanding is that there's also mixed evidence on the autism
>> > link specifically, but I don't know that literature very well.)
>> >
>> > -s
>> >
>> > On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 8:42 AM, Jade Solomon <jade.solomon at me.com>
>> wrote:
>> > > Hello Dream Team,
>> > >
>> > > I've attached some articles you may find interesting, one about mirror
>> > neurons, and one about dreaming.
>> > > I'll try to find and share more related articles.
>> > >
>> > > - Jade
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > Neuro mailing list
>> > > Neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> > > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/neuro
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 2
>> > Date: Wed, 1 May 2013 10:36:23 -0700
>> > From: Anthony Di Franco <di.franco at gmail.com>
>> > To: Sarah Tappon <sarah.tappon at gmail.com>
>> > Cc: neuro <neuro at lists.noisebridge.net>
>> > Subject: Re: [Neuro] Readings on the brain and dreaming
>> > Message-ID:
>> > <CAOJkv1rfu8cpwdnAGgWPgec6Mb=
>> > Zc1xea7RNmOqA-dThuQ83Tg at mail.gmail.com>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>> >
>> > Compare with grandmother cell on a background of fragmentalism vs.
>> wholism
>> > and sparse vs. distributed coding and correlation vs. causation.
>> > On May 1, 2013 9:02 AM, "Sarah Tappon" <sarah.tappon at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > NB: The functional significance of "mirror neurons" in human cognition
>> > > is controversial and a lot of people disagree with Ramachandran. Here
>> > > are some alternate perspectives on the general issue:
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/2012/11/06/whats-so-special-about-mirror-neurons/
>> > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2773693/
>> > >
>> > > (My understanding is that there's also mixed evidence on the autism
>> > > link specifically, but I don't know that literature very well.)
>> > >
>> > > -s
>> > >
>> > > On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 8:42 AM, Jade Solomon <jade.solomon at me.com>
>> > wrote:
>> > > > Hello Dream Team,
>> > > >
>> > > > I've attached some articles you may find interesting, one about
>> mirror
>> > > neurons, and one about dreaming.
>> > > > I'll try to find and share more related articles.
>> > > >
>> > > > - Jade
>> > > >
>> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > Neuro mailing list
>> > > > Neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> > > > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/neuro
>> > > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > Neuro mailing list
>> > > Neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> > > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/neuro
>> > >
>> > -------------- next part --------------
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>> >
>> http://www.noisebridge.net/pipermail/neuro/attachments/20130501/ccb9e2ba/attachment-0001.html
>> > >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 3
>> > Date: Wed, 1 May 2013 16:49:23 -0700
>> > From: LinkReincarnate <linkreincarnate at gmail.com>
>> > To: neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> > Subject: [Neuro] Fwd: tDCS at Noisebridge?
>> > Message-ID:
>> > <
>> > CACHQ1THnyTKg2YMKp0-To0Q-mYfpewtqjOqDo_b-rNw46rtg0A at mail.gmail.com>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>> > From: LinkReincarnate <linkreincarnate at gmail.com>
>> > Date: Wed, May 1, 2013 at 4:44 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [Neuro] tDCS at Noisebridge?
>> > To: Rohan Dixit <rohan at brainbot.me>
>> > Cc: Chung-Hay Luk <luk at chunghay.com>
>> >
>> >
>> > I'll be at noisebridge in about 30 minutes. Also for anyone else who is
>> > interested in a tdcs device of their own. I just made a bulk order to
>> > build about 25 of them. (only enough electrodes for about 7 kits though)
>> > If I had a class at noisebridge on how to build and use tdcs devices
>> would
>> > people show up and buy the kits? I'd charge 70 dollars a device
>> including
>> > nice electrodes (5x7 cm or 5x5 cm conductive silicon sponge pouch
>> > electrodes) We would cover the device itself, the 10-20 system.
>> Popular
>> > montages, and dosage considerations and anything else that people are
>> > interested in.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 10:19 AM, Rohan Dixit <rohan at brainbot.me> wrote:
>> >
>> > > Thanks!
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 10:19 AM, Rohan Dixit <rohan at brainbot.me>
>> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> Well, I'll get one then. Where can i find you?
>> > >>
>> > >> Rohan
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 9:55 AM, LinkReincarnate <
>> > >> linkreincarnate at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >>> for just the pcb? 5 dollars.
>> > >>> On May 1, 2013 8:58 AM, "Rohan Dixit" <rohan at brainbot.me> wrote:
>> > >>>
>> > >>>> That's great, thanks. I saw some open tDCS designs on your website.
>> > >>>> Interesting stuff.
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Would be nice to talk more about it. I'm also interested in a good
>> > >>>> opensource design for tDCS that ideally does some basic things like
>> > >>>> impendance checking, current ramping etc.
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> How much would you ask for your board? I have some electrodes and
>> > wires
>> > >>>> already.
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> (PS I'll be at Noisebridge tonight for the neuro meetup).
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Rohan
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> On Mon, Apr 29, 2013 at 3:49 PM, LinkReincarnate <
>> > >>>> linkreincarnate at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>>> https://nocko.se/2012/07/30/brain-zapping-is-fun/ that is the
>> > >>>>> shematic, bom, and gerber files
>> > >>>>>
>> > >>>>>
>> > >>>>> On Mon, Apr 29, 2013 at 10:55 AM, Rohan Dixit <rohan at brainbot.me
>> > >wrote:
>> > >>>>>
>> > >>>>>> Looks like I missed you this weekend (although I am planning to
>> hang
>> > >>>>>> out at the neuro meetup at noisebridge on Wednesday, if you're
>> > going to be
>> > >>>>>> there.)
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>> I don't know if you've seen the threads from Anthony et al but
>> we're
>> > >>>>>> trying to build a few of these and standardize our results.. The
>> > first step
>> > >>>>>> is building the circuit.
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>> Question: There are a bunch of designs out there-- do you have a
>> > >>>>>> link to your schematic/Eagle file? I am interested in making one
>> > myself, as
>> > >>>>>> I said, but could also buy it from you if the design's similar
>> and
>> > it's
>> > >>>>>> cheap.
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>> Cheers,
>> > >>>>>> Rohan
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>> On Sat, Apr 27, 2013 at 8:13 PM, LinkReincarnate <
>> > >>>>>> linkreincarnate at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>> that covers it I have one left and no electrodes or lead
>> wires. I
>> > >>>>>>> may have some stuff that will work for diy electrodes though.
>> > I'll be at
>> > >>>>>>> noisebridge today for a while. By the time you read this I'll
>> be
>> > there
>> > >>>>>>> actually.
>> > >>>>>>> On Apr 27, 2013 12:24 AM, "Chung-Hay Luk" <luk at chunghay.com>
>> > wrote:
>> > >>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>> Hi Rohan,
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>> Apologies for not getting back to you this week! I've been
>> > >>>>>>>> swamped with work and preparing for the NeuroGaming conference<
>> > http://neurogamingconf.com>that's next week.
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>> I've CC'ed LinkReincernate (Justin) here, since I bought the
>> > >>>>>>>> board and electrodes for my tDCS device from him. As mentioned
>> > before, it's
>> > >>>>>>>> this one: https://nocko.se/2012/07/30/brain-zapping-is-fun/,
>> and
>> > >>>>>>>> the adjustable current range is from 0.5 - 2 mA. The electrodes
>> > are 4" x
>> > >>>>>>>> 4", from Mettler (
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> >
>> http://www.amazon.com/Mettler-Electronics-Sponge-Electrodes-Inserts/dp/B003XWZVIS/ref=sr_1_11
>> > ).
>> > >>>>>>>> Justin, feel free to add more details, if I've forgotten
>> anything
>> > key.
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>> Rohan, I'm available to chat in person next Friday (May 3) or
>> > the
>> > >>>>>>>> following week (May 6-10). Let me know what works best for you.
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>> Smiles,
>> > >>>>>>>> Chung-Hay
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>> On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 12:35 AM, Rohan Dixit <
>> rohan at brainbot.me
>> > >wrote:
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>> Hi Chung!
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>> Thanks for your kind message, and I'd love to get in touch
>> with
>> > >>>>>>>>> LinkReincarnate.
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>> Also, curious to hear your experiences and motivations for the
>> > >>>>>>>>> tDCS rig you've got-- are you around for a coffee or something
>> > sometime
>> > >>>>>>>>> this week?
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>> > >>>>>>>>> Rohan
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 12:30 PM, Chung-Hay Luk <
>> > luk at chunghay.com>wrote:
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Hi!
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> I've built the device posted by LinkReincarnate (
>> > >>>>>>>>>> https://nocko.se/2012/07/30/brain-zapping-is-fun/). Current
>> is
>> > >>>>>>>>>> adjustable from 0.5 - 2 mA. I unfortunately don't have
>> spares,
>> > but
>> > >>>>>>>>>> LinkReincarnate might? Maybe he'll reply to this thread. If
>> > not, PM me, and
>> > >>>>>>>>>> I can ask him on your behalf.
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> My friends and I have been experimenting with tDCS over
>> motor
>> > >>>>>>>>>> cortex for now, and I'd be happy to nerd out with others. My
>> > background is
>> > >>>>>>>>>> also in electrophysiology (+ brain training).
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Smiles,
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Chung-Hay
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> @Kelly: Miss you! Come visit!
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 11:55 AM, Anthony Di Franco <
>> > >>>>>>>>>> di.franco at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> I built one, and I have parts for about 5 more. It's a very
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> simple design I came up with that is just a regulated
>> current
>> > source
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> adjustable from 0-2mA.
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> I only tested it by measuring its output current with a
>> meter
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> and not through a brain.
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Let me know if you want some parts for one.
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> I'm mostly around sudo room in Oakland these days, so you
>> could
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> come check out sudo room as well if you want.
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Anthony
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 17, 2013 11:44 AM, "Kelly" <
>> hurtstotouchfire at gmail.com>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Hi rohan,
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> I moved to Boston, but there are indeed a few Noisebridge
>> > folks
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> that have built tdcs rigs. I'm sure they would be happy to
>> > chat with you.
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> See the Noisebridge Neuro list, cc-ed.
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Kelly
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 17, 2013 3:55 AM, "Rohan Dixit" <rohan at brainbot.me>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi there,
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Was wondering if I could find some people interested in
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> building a tDCS device. Have you built one before?
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> My background is in neuroimaging and electrophysiology
>> but am
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> very interested in tDCS. Would you be kind enough to have
>> > tea or coffee
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> sometime this week at your convenience so I can "pick your
>> > brain" (promise
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> no devices involved!)
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rohan
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rohan Dixit
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> www.brainbot.me
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Neuro mailing list
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/neuro
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Neuro mailing list
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> > >>>>>>>>>>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/neuro
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>> --
>> > >>>>>>>>> Rohan Dixit
>> > >>>>>>>>> www.brainbot.me
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>> --
>> > >>>>>> Rohan Dixit
>> > >>>>>> TEDx video: Meditation neurotechnology <
>> > http://youtu.be/8uSPygIPqIo>
>> > >>>>>> www.brainbot.me
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>
>> > >>>>>
>> > >>>>> --
>> > >>>>> www.linkreincarnate.com
>> > >>>>>
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> --
>> > >>>> Rohan Dixit
>> > >>>> TEDx video: Meditation neurotechnology <
>> http://youtu.be/8uSPygIPqIo>
>> > >>>> www.brainbot.me
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> --
>> > >> Rohan Dixit
>> > >> TEDx video: Meditation neurotechnology <http://youtu.be/8uSPygIPqIo
>> >
>> > >> www.brainbot.me
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > Rohan Dixit
>> > > TEDx video: Meditation neurotechnology <http://youtu.be/8uSPygIPqIo>
>> > > www.brainbot.me
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > www.linkreincarnate.com
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > www.linkreincarnate.com
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>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Neuro mailing list
>> > Neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/neuro
>> >
>> >
>> > End of Neuro Digest, Vol 32, Issue 3
>> > ************************************
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> www.linkreincarnate.com
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>> _______________________________________________
>> Neuro mailing list
>> Neuro at lists.noisebridge.net
>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/neuro
>>
>>
>> End of Neuro Digest, Vol 32, Issue 4
>> ************************************
>>
>
>
>
> --
> www.linkreincarnate.com
>
--
www.linkreincarnate.com
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