[Noisebridge-discuss] Enlightenment & its discontents (response to Rachel, Jim, Frantisek et al)

Mike Schachter mschachter at eigenminds.com
Sat Aug 18 19:37:28 UTC 2012


I'm really sorry to see Rachel's initial suggestion for Noisebridge to
adopt some sort of anti-harassment statement devolve into something
more drama oriented and personal.

I'm also sorry to see so many people not support her suggestion for
Noisebridge to adopt any sort of anti-harassment statement. I really
don't see how anything negative could come of doing so.

 mike




On Sat, Aug 18, 2012 at 12:31 PM, rachel lyra hospodar
<rachelyra at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Tony,
>
> Thanks for working to engage in a considered way on this issue!  It's
> a really uncomfortable but necessary one!  Regrets for any lack of
> clarity around the way I read nb-discuss, some more details and some
> thoughts on why I shared the fact of the filtering:
>
> I use this email address for mailing lists, I belong to many.  Mailing
> lists are, to me, still the single most fungible and successful tool
> for creating online communities.  By filtering mail from certain lists
> to certain folders, I am able to subscribe to many high-volume lists
> and scores of low-volume lists without having undifferentiated chaos
> in my inbox.
>
> I am deeply interested in the metacognitive repercussions of the
> "sortability" of electronic commmunications.  For example, I have six
> or seven arduino and microcontroller-specific mailing lists that all
> sort into one shared folder.  This way, when I am working on
> electronics or seeking to delve into the topic further, I have one
> really rich place where all those email inputs are collected.  It is
> interesting to me the way this creates a psychologically real 'bounded
> space' that is functionally identical to a room full of people.  I put
> Michael Shiloh and the amarino toolkit list into the same room because
> I want to read them at the same time.
>
> I put sustainability interest groups and lists together, small
> business & neighborhood localization lists together, etc.  I actually
> send nb-discuss, nb-announce, and all of my noisebridge sublists to
> the same folder.  Which I read regularly.
>
> Sometimes, when someone is still getting their shit together on how to
> setup their list, they will put me on but then the way the emails
> comes in varies so much I have to make a number of different filters
> to keep them in the correct folder and out of in the main inbox.  Then
> I sometimes solve the problem by filtering all of that person's emails
> to the right place.  Their incompetent netiquette loses them their
> access to my primary inbox.  Some people go one step up the ladder and
> issue new email addresses for each list they are on, so they can track
> who shares their address and if needed remove the offenders' ability
> to reach them at all.  Once I set up some more stuff I might go
> further down this route, but for now I only do this in a few cases.
>
> I have done this here as a metacognitive hack to place these
> interactions with Frantisek back into the public sphere.  I am sharing
> that I have done it, as a way of documenting the hack and
> open-sourcing it.
>
>> good guys, too. This awkward discussion could lead to something
>> enlightening, purrr haps?
>
> That's my hypothesis, and is of course the reason I initiated and I am
> forcing the continuation of the conversation even though it is
> awkward.  I wish I thought that you had noticed this congruency,
> instead of this sentence reading to me as a piece of advice.  But hey,
> maybe it's not even advice or maybe it's advice that is not directed
> at me, and you are agreeing with me and stating your good opinion of
> my solution.
>
> I can only hope that over time support of and agreeance with the
> specific actions I am taking in this realm would be more often stated
> explicitly rather than implicitly.  It really speeds up the adoption
> of the technologies I am building.
>
> hey, a girl can dream, can't she?
>
> R.
>
> On Sat, Aug 18, 2012 at 11:24 AM, Tony Longshanks LeTigre
> <anthonyletigre at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Rachel Lyra wrote:
>> Frantisek emailed me privately, but I am responding publicly.
>>
>> The text of his email is included below. I've done this before....once,
>> twice, three times maybe? When I felt someone has sent me something
>> privately that should be addressed by the community at large. In such cases
>> I don't ask permission, the same way I don't always ask permission when
>> borrowing things from the web for zines I make. I believe in taking what you
>> need, to a certain point. I accept a certain amount of "being taken from" as
>> "That's Life," by the same token. I'm aware when posting a private message
>> publicly that it is a breach of the usual protocol & therefore reserved for
>> certain (usually heated) occasions. I've also done it in the past knowing
>> (to my annoyance) that it would be dismissed as "stirring up drama," since I
>> know I was branded that way at a time when there was a lot of inappropriate
>> shit happening @ Noisebridge that I was calling people on. (I solved that
>> problem by making my visits to NB more sporadic & usually not staying very
>> long.)
>>
>> One thing I don't get, Rachel, is that you said you don't as a rule read
>> NB-Discuss posts, you filter them to your junk bin, is that correct? I
>> suppose the majority of NB-Discuss posts aren't worth your time, but it does
>> strike me as a little arrogant that you deign to engender (ha!) a dialogue
>> on a mailing list that you otherwise ignore. How do you know others aren't
>> starting dialogues on similarly important matters the rest of the time?
>>
>> Perhaps I misunderstand you. I agree with much of what you're saying & even
>> relate to your fierce attitude in a lot of ways. I think Frantisek & Jim are
>> good guys, too. This awkward discussion could lead to something
>> enlightening, purrr haps?
>>
>>
>> Yr friendly neighborhood Tiger
>>
>>
>>
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