[Noisebridge-discuss] "Banning" discussion tonight

[Al Sweigart]

Mitch, Lee Sonko knew about the banning proposal. I had personally been in
discussion with him about it. I was surprised that he didn't show up to the
meeting.

And this is why Noisebridge isn't a safe space: after months of on-and-off
harassment, Tom brings up this consensus proposal, it's on the docket for
weeks, and actually manages to pass consensus. Yet after all these hurdles
were overcome, Lee can defy his ban and come back into the space and debate
his banning.

Because Mitch says so. Even though he's a member and could have blocked for
more discussion.

We treat abusive people with kid gloves, and even when we manage to get
something passed consensus and say, "Yes, this person should be banned",
Mitch still wants to have a do-over.

Mitch, do you respect consensus? Or only when it agrees with you?


On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 2:40 PM, Praveen Sinha <dmhomee at gmail.com> wrote:

> I love you Naomi!!!!  Community meeting is a GREAT idea :)  I don't know
> if I can be there tonight, but I'll try my best.
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 2:37 PM, Naomi Most <pnaomi at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I will be there.  I also feel this is an extremely important
>> discussion, and goes much deeper than simply the use of a ban.
>>
>> I have a solution in mind to avoid these situations, something I
>> brought up a few meetings ago: a "community" meeting.
>>
>> Misunderstandings shouldn't be allowed to scale to the level of
>> "drama".  In our current "system", we only have two modes: the general
>> meeting and noisebridge-discuss.  The former is simply an
>> inappropriate venue for addressing interpersonal issues, and the
>> latter... well.
>>
>> Now that I see to what ridiculous level the Noisebridge version of
>> justice can be taken in response to interpersonal issues that should
>> never have escalated, it's time we consider strongly the idea of
>> having a Community meeting in addition to the NB general meeting.
>>
>> --Naomi
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 2:08 PM, Mitch Altman <maltman23 at hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > Unfortunately I won't be able to be at tonight's meeting.  But I want to
>> > encourage discussion of "Banning".
>> >
>> > It is important to get rid of people who melt use, rather contribute to
>> the
>> > culture of Noisebridge and is mission and vision.  It is also important
>> to
>> > ban people who are disruptive, make many people uncomfortable, or are
>> > violent or hateful.
>> >
>> > It is also important to not use banning as a means of getting rid of
>> someone
>> > because you don't like them, or because you have a misunderstanding or
>> > argument.
>> >
>> > Banning is a drastic measure, and (unless for violent or hateful or
>> illegal
>> > behavior) should only be done when other means have been exhausted.
>> >
>> > These concepts need to be discussed and explored.
>> >
>> > A specific case came to my attention recently.  Lee Sony was apparently
>> > banned without him being allowed to present his position.  He will be at
>> > tonight's meeting.  I hope people will listen and respond.  I feel this
>> is
>> > important.
>> >
>> > Best,
>> > Mitch.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>> > Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>> > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Naomi Theora Most
>> naomi at nthmost.com
>> +1-415-728-7490
>>
>> skype: nthmost
>>
>> http://twitter.com/nthmost
>> _______________________________________________
>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>>
>
>
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