[Noisebridge-discuss] [drama] the one where Danny flames out spectacularly

zephyr q zv at offblast.org
Sat Jun 22 20:44:11 UTC 2013

boom roasted.

On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 7:09 PM, Danny O'Brien <danny at spesh.com> wrote:
> Ever Falling,
> As delightful as ever.
> 1)  Mea culpa. I have changed the subject line.
> 2) If your question is more accurately, "is anyone going to deal with the
> serious issue", yes, they will. However, they won't do it on a mailing list,
> because that is the DUMBEST PLACE IN THE WORLD to try and solve a problem
> like this. You think that the thread ends with Dru going "cor blimey, it's a
> fair cop, guv" and going meekly somewhere else in an attachment, or people
> sending CSI recreations of the scene in Autocad? No of course not, people
> actually sort this stuff out by sorting out in real life. Then other people
> will freak out at the people doing the sorting out and accuse them of a
> kangaroo court or mob justice or something. Look, already in this thread,
> I'm sure one person is accusing me of caring more about Noisebridge than a
> serious assault, and the other person thinks I'm part of a feminazi
> conspiracy to silence him on bugzilla. On Planet NotCrazyPants, we'd just
> sitting gasping politely at how much Bre just made or something. Here,
> no-one is being nice or sane at all, and I include me, because I am
> temporarily indulging my entirely rare craving to MIX IT UP. Which brings me
> to my next question:
> 3) Ever Falling, what do you do in the space? When did you last come here?
> What is it you are working on again?
> d.
> On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 8:16 AM, Ever Falling <everfalling at gmail.com> wrote:
>> How about instead of getting butthurt that someone called NB a "stupid
>> science lab" how about you address her actual complaint about sticking to
>> the topic of an alleged sexual assault like one of those smart,
>> enthusiastic, vaguely sane people you try to seek out?
>> On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 6:10 PM, Danny O'Brien <danny at spesh.com> wrote:
>>> Oh, and I should probably say despite my ranting and despite the serious
>>> tone of this email, I can almost certainly be persuaded back from my descent
>>> into Stalinism and back to joyous acceptance of all Noisebridge's craziness,
>>> in all its forms. I'm pretty sure it would be really easy.
>>> d.
>>> On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 7:55 AM, Danny O'Brien <danny at spesh.com> wrote:
>>>> On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 6:47 AM, Bill Gag <billgag11 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>> The fact that this discussion has gone from Dru's behavior to more
>>>>> people bitching about their stupid science lab being used as a resource by
>>>>> homeless people is disgusting, Dru's behavior is terrible even if the space
>>>>> was a fucking office.
>>>>> The fact that every discussion has to be used to define the space is
>>>>> irritating enough but this discussion is no place for that shit, get the
>>>>> fuck out of here and be safe at home.
>>>> Hey Kim,
>>>> You're right that it's important to make the stupid science lab safe for
>>>> everyone. But, speaking personally, I can't do that *and* make it as a
>>>> resource for homeless people or people who are just generally hanging out.
>>>> It's too much. It takes a lot of time and energy to deal with the normal
>>>> traumatastic drama that emerges from dealing with all the problems that
>>>> hacker culture has, *and* deal with people who are trying to deal with a
>>>> bunch of other societal issues, like poverty, homelessness and mental
>>>> illness, *plus* the people who prey on open spaces and open communities in
>>>> general.
>>>> It's a stupid science lab, but that's all it is meant to be. We had a
>>>> science lab experiment trying to make it welcoming by just being open all
>>>> the time so that anyone could come in at any time, but in the end that just
>>>> end up excluding whole classes of people (including a lot of whiteboy
>>>> hackers, but also hackers of every other kind), and constructing an
>>>> atmosphere of entitlement with a bunch of people who aren't doing the stuff
>>>> that the place is designed to encourage.
>>>> I'm burned out, because the place needs smart, enthusiastic, vaguely
>>>> sane people to help things run smoothly, and a great deal of my time is
>>>> dominated by the consequences of people who clutch hold of it for other
>>>> reasons than it was designed for, and need to, frankly, sort their shit out
>>>> somewhere else.
>>>> You've only just subscribe to nb-discuss, Kim, but you know that I've
>>>> invested a lot of time social sysadminning trying to sort out problems among
>>>> people and mediate solutions. I don't really often go off on one like this.
>>>> But really, I have to draw the line somewhere.
>>>> So here's one the new lines I'm drawing for myself. If you think that
>>>> this is a "stupid science lab", please leave.  Anyone who seriously says
>>>> that for a moment is not welcome by me, anymore. You should go. There are
>>>> other places you can go, less full of horrible science geeks. There are
>>>> other places you can build yourself, that might be more welcoming.
>>>> We have a lot of problems, and we can't solve them all, and right now,
>>>> we can't solve yours, particularly when you're actively scorning the very
>>>> reason we wanted to share our space with you.
>>>> I'm sorry. Please go.
>>>> d.
>>>>> The fact is, that making the space exclusive or anything of that sort
>>>>> would NOT solve this problem, the presence of predatory men and people there
>>>>> to defend them is, and no matter how you view the space, this needs to be
>>>>> dealt with, because as long as humans use noisebridge there will be this
>>>>> sorta shit.
>>>>> Because its not a safe space. Its a hostile one, only safe for white
>>>>> men with houses or jobs. Until that changes, this shit will continue. The
>>>>> argument over the use of the space is merely an extension of this shit
>>>>> behavior.
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>>>>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>>>>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
>>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
>>> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> _______________________________________________
> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss

More information about the Noisebridge-discuss mailing list